The Game Changers

Emma Wilson: Flying on Foils, Keeping the Joy

• Sue Anstiss • Season 21 • Episode 3

Share episode

Emma Wilson: Flying on Foils, Keeping the Joy

“Two bronzes, two completely different emotions. Tokyo was joy. Paris… it broke me inside. It’s taken a long time to process and move forward.”

Emma Wilson is transforming the face of British windsurfing. A world champion at every age group, Olympic bronze medallist in Tokyo, and now the youngest Briton ever to claim a senior world title, Emma talks openly about the highs and lows of life on the water.

She reflects on growing up in a family of elite athletes, the sibling rivalry that drove her forward and the tough leap from youth prodigy to senior racing. Emma relives the joy of her first Olympic medal, the heartbreak of Paris 2024 and the resilience it took to come back stronger as world number one.

From mastering the switch to foiling and the crashes that followed to rediscovering the fun that first inspired her, Emma’s story is one of courage, reinvention and embracing joy.

A fearless competitor with an infectious love for her sport, Emma Wilson is proof that when you protect that joy, the medals will follow.

Thank you to Sport England who support The Game Changers Podcast with a National Lottery award.

Find out more about The Game Changers podcast here: https://www.fearlesswomen.co.uk/thegamechangers

Hosted by Sue Anstiss
Produced by Sam Walker, What Goes On Media

A Fearless Women production

Emma Wilson:

I had a really good start, good downwind, and then I made a mistake on the outwind. And then I just remember like thinking that was the gold medal. That was gone. I just remember that little final downwind I was just crying in my head to myself. Yeah, that's brutal.

John Wilson:

Emma Wilson is rewriting the story of British windsurfing. In this episode of The Game Changers, we'll hear how her fearless racing and relentless drive have established Emma as one of the most exciting talents in world saving today. Her extraordinary career has seen her following in the footsteps of her mum, a former British windsurfing champion, to win world and European titles in every age category. Emma made history in Tokyo winning Olympic bronze at just 22, and last summer won another bronze at the Paris Games, albeit in very different circumstances. This summer she became the youngest Britain ever to claim a world championship title. Emma, your mum Penny, broke many barriers as Britain's top windsurfer in the 80s and 90s. So growing up, did that feel like it was pure inspiration for you or did it bring a lot of pressure to Yeah, I guess when I was really young, I didn't really realise how good she was.

Emma Wilson:

For me, she was just my mum, and like I had an older I have an older brother as well. And um, so she kind of just taught us how to windsurf. But I until I was like I think 12 or 13, I started to go to some of the training camps, and then people knew my mum, and then I started realizing oh she's pretty good at this. Um, and yeah, and then found yeah, I guess I didn't really ask her too much until that point. But yeah, it's super cool.

John Wilson:

And your dad, John Wilson, who I've not had the pleasure of knowing uh for many, many years, but he was a great rower too, so it almost feels like you were just destined to have this success on the water.

Emma Wilson:

Yeah, I guess everyone speaks about my mum a lot because I do the windsurfing and kind of doing the same sport as her, but my finger dad was pretty amazing athlete as well. So as a kid I was nonstop, like I couldn't stop doing things, and I think that's probably down to them being two athletes, yeah. Like having that in your as you're growing up is pretty cool.

John Wilson:

Was rowing ever an option for you?

Emma Wilson:

Uh I did try it actually because he had a rowing boat and he would go out. So I did try it a few times and I actually did like the indoor when I was 12, 13, indoor rowing championship. Yeah. I did all right, I think, but I was like, oh, this is really hard, and I didn't like the indoor side of this. Yeah, I think the windsurfing in the end took yeah, it was more fun.

John Wilson:

And do you looking back, do you remember the moment that you just fell in love with windsurfing? Did you say it was your kind of mum taking you and your brother out on the water? But was there a moment or a a time that you remember?

Emma Wilson:

Yeah, I guess at the beginning with my brother, he was just always better than me, and I didn't really enjoy it that much. And then probably because my brother wanted to do it, we went to a world championship when I was 2011. And and I ended up winning it. I wasn't expecting to win it, like, and then I think at that moment I was like, wow, like this could be my life. And yeah, I think after that, then I was like, oh yeah, I'm gonna do this for the rest of my life.

John Wilson:

And it was he a windsover too, is your brother? How much older is he than you?

Emma Wilson:

Uh yeah, he's 18 months older. So yeah, he he stopped now, but he did race until he was like 19, 20, and now he works in Australia. But um, yeah, he was really good, and that's probably why it kept pushing me like to the next level. And I think growing up with a brother as well, you just end up trying to be better than them, and yeah, no. It was really I'm really grateful for like the upbringing I had because it's probably made me who I am today.

John Wilson:

That's amazing, isn't it? There's just the 18 months difference, and I remember hearing about him too from your dad. But that kind of success of the two of you. I mean, imagine us as a parent to have one athlete on that pathway, but to have the two of you there. And and as you say, that was a kind of competition and an inspiration too. How does he how's he felt about your career as he's seeing that progress?

Emma Wilson:

Oh, I think he's proud. Um, yeah, like it's probably a bit easier now. We don't because when we were younger, we competed directly against each other. Yeah, so when you're young, you're not split between girls and boys, you're just against each other. So yeah, ended up there was a few arguments, just I guess siblings rivalry. But um, yeah, now I guess when we do see each other, now I think he's just proud. And I mean, for he's got a really nice job and nice life in Australia, so I'm pretty, pretty happy for him too.

John Wilson:

And and in terms of the feeling that you felt when you, I guess that discovered and fell in love with windsurfing, can you describe that? And is that something that you still feel today? Do you have those those kind of same sensations from the sport now?

Emma Wilson:

Yeah, I guess um I just really like the feeling you're kind of in control and you're in but you're also free of the the busy world, like you you can control what you're doing on the water. And I love to go fast and I'm also competitive, so I think all three of those things, that's probably what I've fallen in love with. And then even now, yeah, like I guess it's my job kind of, although I don't really see it's my job, but some days it is I guess you have bad sessions like everyone does, but I always come back to like um just enjoying like why am I doing this? Actually, because I enjoy a sport and sometimes I just go for 20 minutes on my own, go and mess around, be a kid again, and that always brings me back to yeah, like I just do so much better when I'm enjoying it. So I think that's probably how I've got this far.

John Wilson:

It's so important though, isn't it? And I think sometimes, especially with elite athletes, it's easy to forget the joy that what brought you to it in the first place, that it is the joy of of taking part and and enjoying the sport.

Emma Wilson:

Yeah, I think that's just something I've always said, like I don't want to lose, however, serious, however much, I don't know if you're the best in the world, but still, if you're not enjoying it, it's not gonna be much fun. So I've always said just to make sure I'm enjoying it.

John Wilson:

And you mentioned kind of winning that world title. Was that when you were just 12? I think under the Golden Gate Bridge, was that the first title that you won?

Emma Wilson:

Yeah.

John Wilson:

So how did it feel? I guess what does a 12-year-old feel in that moment of becoming world champion for your age group? But it just done an extraordinary achievement. Can you remember how you felt at that time?

Emma Wilson:

Oh, I guess I mean, I just remembered like there was me and I had a really good friend who are still really good friends with now. And we were we were kind of just we did a race and then we got to come into the beach in between the race and then go back out for the next one. And every time we came to the beach, we just had like a bag of sweets. So for me, I was just kind of loving it because I did well in the race, I get some sweets, and I go back out and do another race. Also, you I remember meeting like one of the Israel girls that we were competing against, and now we're still competing against her like however many years later. So that's what's also cool, I think, is you meet like friends from all over the world, and even at that such a young age.

John Wilson:

And it's incredible that you kept going, isn't it? Because I think it was at 15 you were youth world champion, you were named Young Sailor of the Year, and you were tipped by Sportsaid to be one to watch. So I just wonder whether, as a teenager, maybe you weren't even aware of that at the time, but whether you ever thought all my stuff peaked too soon. Because we do see, especially in track and field and other sports, you see like athletes having huge success very young, but then they don't manage to continue that on into adulthood. Did you ever feel that at all?

Emma Wilson:

No, I guess there was a hard moment when I finished GCSEs and then had to decide whether to go full-time windsurfing or carry on education, and I chose to go full-time, which I think was right a big decision. For me, that felt like a big decision. And then that year later, I was moving into the senior category, which is a bit of a shock to the system when you've only done youth events. I think the first year was pretty difficult, but I travelled a lot with my mum and she was always with me and always quite supportive. And yeah, I think if I hadn't had my mum there with me, I probably would have not carried on because it is hard when you're coming your youth world champion and then you go to senior fleet and you're coming last. Like it's a long, long journey. Um pretty humbling, pretty quick. Yeah. Definitely was a tough first few years in the senior fleet. But because I was so young, I think no one really saw that because no one's expecting me to do well then. It was probably just me that felt like, oh, this is terrible.

John Wilson:

And could you have continued in education? I'm interested in that decision. I guess that's a a bit as a parent myself, but it's almost like who makes that decision? Is that your decision? Was that yours and your coaches and your parents too? Because that's a big life decision, isn't it, at that point to go professional so young?

Emma Wilson:

Yeah, it was it was really hard. And um, yeah, my mum, my mum was always been like involved, really supportive. And then uh I my coach at the time was also like really supportive, and they were kind of like, it's your decision at the end of the day. Like, I don't think anyone thought it was a bad idea, but I was I'm not sure if anyone thought I'd actually go for it. And I remember the first few months I'd finished school and all my friends were going back to do A levels, and I was like, Oh, I could do two training sessions on my own. Oh, this is actually a big jump. But I think I guess you learn a lot about yourself and um self-discipline, and yeah, I think that's yeah, it's just a different road, I guess.

John Wilson:

I was gonna talk to you later about funding, and because clearly it's an expensive sport in terms of travelling and the equipment, and you obviously have y some UK sport funding for that, but has that been a challenge for you across that time to be a professional? I think you are you making money as you're competing and having success. How how does that work for you?

Emma Wilson:

Yeah, I mean, probably now it's kicking now. I'm actually earning a bit of money on the side, but yeah, it's taken a long time. Like obviously, when I went full-time, my parents were supporting me, and then I was on like the lowest level of UK sport funding when I went full-time. But with windsurfing, we have to like pay for all our equipment, and that's the biggest cost, really, is because it it makes a big difference if you have good equipment. And then also when we travel all around the world, obviously, it's a bit expensive, so yeah, like always finding ways to try and like my dad helps me with the sponsorship side. I wouldn't be here without my family's support, I guess. And then with British sailing, now I'm yeah, I'm pretty good funding through UK sport, which is really helpful, and solely so you you get there, but it is it's a long journey.

John Wilson:

Yeah, it's been hard work, isn't it? I think I guess I've seen from the other side. So I've received those newsletters from your dad and the updates on your progress, and so I kind of feel I've seen how hard work it has been to get you as a c as an athlete to where you are today. So it is uh yeah, just amazing to see the success of that because for some athletes they'll put in all that time and funding and investment, but don't necessarily have the success at the other side too. So it's been uh yeah, interesting to see see that journey to where you are today. In Tokyo in 2021, you were just 22, the youngest member of Team GB's sailing team, and I think you were leading, weren't you, into that final medal race, but eventually took bronze, just a one point off of gold. I wonder looking back, did you feel like it was a massive triumph to get bronze, or were you disappointed? And did you feel like you'd kind of lost the gold?

Emma Wilson:

For sure, in Tokyo it felt like a massive achievement. I was so happy just to get a medal. I was, yeah, one of the youngest, if not the youngest, in the fleet, and all like the whole cycle had just been coming forth. Like I think I finished fourth at the free world championships. So going to the Olympics, I remember like chatting to my mum before, and obviously the British sailing like were really quite good, and I knew people were going and they were pretty likely to win, if not get a medal. Like, and I was like to my mum, I don't want to be the only one who doesn't get a medal. Like I don't want to let down the team. So yeah, I think I got a medal, and it was the first medal for the British sailing team. And it's funny because like I've won a few medals in my career, but definitely the Tokyo one I'd say is was like, yeah, it was just amazing, and like everyone was so happy, and yeah, I remember that for the rest of my life.

John Wilson:

That's brilliant. Almost was that the first one that was the first sailing medal awarded in the Olympics there.

Emma Wilson:

Yeah, so it was the first one, and because we kind of all staggered throughout the competition. Yeah. And yeah, so I remember I went home and back to the accommodation, and everyone like greeted me, and and that was really nice. And then obviously everyone goes back to like focus. And I remember I was walking down the corridor with my bronze medal, and I saw Hannah Mills, who is like double Olympic gold medalist now, and I saw her and I remember thinking, Oh god, should I hide it? Because like I don't want to like distract her, or anyway, she's just keeping me a big car and was so happy for me. And yeah, I think it was cool to be surrounded by that like calibre of people as well.

John Wilson:

It's really interesting, isn't it? Actually, Hannah was a lovely guest on the Game Changers too. She's amazing, amazing woman, isn't she? But I I think it's interesting that being in a sport like sailing or rowing or cycling where you're surrounded by so many others winning gold that actually I hadn't thought about that before, but that does bring a real pressure almost to perform because you're with so many athletes of such caliber.

Emma Wilson:

Yeah, no, I think because of COVID as well, we hadn't spent that much time as a team together, so I didn't know them that well. Like as a kid, I seen them growing up and seen them win the Olympic medals, and then suddenly I was going to the games with them. But yeah, once we arrived, they were everyone was so friendly, and I felt like a little kid in the team. So everyone like looked after me. Yeah, it was just a really nice experience.

John Wilson:

That's lovely to hear, isn't it? And ahead of Paris, the Paris Olympics, your sport changed quite dramatically. So can you explain the difference between the RSX, kind of where you were with windsurfing, and then the IQ foil that it switched to for Paris?

Emma Wilson:

Yeah, so in Tokyo we were like just on a normal windsurfer, like skimming across the water. And then after Tokyo, they swapped it to like a foiling windsurfer. So you're flying like a metre above the water, and it kind of just makes it all a lot faster, a lot more like exciting, you have bigger crashes. It was a bit more like um, I guess a bit more like BMX racing sort of thing. And they also changed like the scoring formats to make it a bit more like a knockout series. So all cycle we were kind of practicing that. Um it was a big jump for me to go from just like normal windsurfing to this first had to learn how to fly on this windsurfer, and then I had to try and work out how I was gonna attempt to race this new like format. And the first few months I just crashed for like six months, broke some toes and hurt my body a bit, and then eventually got into it. And yeah, it's fun, it's good.

John Wilson:

And did it feel like as you just said that like a completely new discipline? So, did you have to change your body shape, bec build new strength for you, the kind of difference in terms of the way you train for it?

Emma Wilson:

Yeah, I had to change my body shape. It's basically it's faster if you're heavier on the new the foiling windsurfer. So at the time I was like 55 kilos in Tokyo, and I had to I think in Paris I was nearly 70. Like it was a big jump.

John Wilson:

Oh my gosh, wow.

Emma Wilson:

Yeah, and I guess like I found it quite hard at the start because I didn't I didn't want to be like seen in this big person. People would come up to me and say, Oh, you've you've got bigger. I was like, Oh great, thanks. But I yeah, I did it in Marcel, I went to the gym.

John Wilson:

It's weird, isn't it? I remember s hearing someone talking about this just recently with rugby, but like with men, we go, Oh god, you look big, you look stacked, like it's a compliment. But but it doesn't ever feel like that with a woman to say, Oh, you've got bigger, you've got you know stronger and more muscular. But actually, uh for your sport, I absolutely that's where you needed to be to have that success. So, was that done? Was that mainly in the gym? Was that weights and nutrition? How did you manage to change?

Emma Wilson:

I mean, actually for me, I hadn't actually really been to the gym much in before Tokyo. Like, I guess I just loved windsurfing and I was pretty good at windsurfing, so I kind of just said, like, I just want to do all my fitness because it's pretty physical, you can do it on the water. But then obviously, after when I had to put on the weight, I was like, okay, I probably need to go to a gym. So I guess because I hadn't been much, it it was actually quite quick the change. And then, yeah, just like going consistently, I guess, to the gym. It's not my favourite thing to do, but yeah, get it done and then go and enjoy the on the water sessions.

John Wilson:

And how have you it's just interesting? I booked for my husband and I to have uh over at Bray Lake to do some of the foiling. We booked a lesson to to learn to foil, uh, which we didn't get around to last summer. I've still got that booked on need to do that. Because I think when I've watched them, it's just been a m I think it looks like they're flying, it looks amazing. And I realise it's not as easy as I as I perceive from standing on the bank. But um, in terms of a sensation for you, does it does it feel very different to how you had felt traditionally windsurfing?

Emma Wilson:

Yeah, it's it's pretty different. I remember the first few times I went on it and it's like so quiet. Like you can you can talk to your friend whilst windsurfing because there's no like sound whilst in the old windsurfing, like you hear the water, the waves. So it's pretty yeah. So that was the biggest change for me. I was like, whoa, I can chat. And then yeah, you just it's different on your body as well, like different muscles.

John Wilson:

And and you were one of only three women in the world, I believe, that qualify both for Tokyo and then for Paris. So, what do you think gave you that edge to adapt to the new format in the way that perhaps others couldn't do?

Emma Wilson:

I don't know. I think because I just love windsurfing and I wasn't afraid to like shut myself around the front a few times and I crashed a lot, which I think was the quickest way to learn. You learn pretty quick what not to do when you crash. So I guess I've always been a bit I don't know if that's from my brother or what, but always like finding the limits and pushing the limits. And like even now, like um with my coach yesterday, we were planning, and uh it was like what's like your goal? And I was like, to be honest, now it's not like winning medals, it's more like I want to see how far I can take the sport and push the limit. And like I always watch the boys out there and think, oh, I could do that a bit better than that. So I'll try. And sometimes it doesn't end perfectly, and you learn what not to do. But yeah, I think having that attitude has definitely helped me.

John Wilson:

Excellent. And you mentioned that in Paris there was this new medal format race, so designed in theory for drama, but criticized by many as potentially unfair. And and it within the games, you dominated all week hugely, only to lose gold in that sudden death showdown. So can you just kind of take us back there? What are your strongest memories of of that final day?

Emma Wilson:

Oh yeah, so so actually the final day was postponed one day. So we had one day of waiting for wind, and then I was so tired. I hadn't slept that night, I was so nervous, and then I actually fell asleep in that afternoon waiting for the race, and then my physio woke me off and was like, Oh, you're not racing, you can go home. So I was like, Oh god, not another day. And then actually the next day I felt so much better. I actually slept and I was pretty yeah, ready for it. I actually got protested though, like an hour before the race. I'm not sure if anyone knows about this.

John Wilson:

What does that mean?

Emma Wilson:

So they have like a jury, and we have lots of in Salem, we have lots of rules about equipment, and anyway, the jury felt like I'd done something different with my equipment before the medal race. In the end, they did the whole process. I had to go sit in the room in front of five jury and explain, and in the end it was it was fine, it was just a lot of stress.

John Wilson:

When is that? In the morning, the morning of the day that you're gonna race.

Emma Wilson:

Yeah, so that was like half an hour before my race. And then I got out of that, and then I was like, okay, I need to go and like sit down on my own for 10 minutes, sort myself out, and actually, yeah, got out for the race. So it's just one final race, and um had a really good start, good downwind, and then I made a mistake on the outwind, and then I just remember like thinking that was the gold medal that I was gone. It hit me because it's so hard to catch up, like once you lost that amount of I don't know how many meters it was in the end, but it was quite a lot. And I just remember that the final downwind, I was just crying in my myself, like yeah, it was yeah, it's brutal. I don't know. It was it's funny because I was thinking about it today, like the two different bronze medals and how you can have two different, completely different emotions, like Tokyo was so archite and like amazing, and then Paris, yeah, just I don't know, just kind of broming inside, and it's taken a long, long time to even like process it and move forward, I guess.

John Wilson:

And I think to be clear to people that didn't see, I remember watching it on television at the time, and my mate makes me wet up thinking about it, and that's just me as a viewer watching your devastation. But but also the fact that going into it, you were so far ahead from all the the kind of qualification and the getting to that point. So it wasn't as if it was a it didn't feel equal at that point. You've been surprised, and I think you've missed out on some of the practice runs because you've been so far ahead, you hadn't had those extra opportunities on that course too. Is that right?

Emma Wilson:

Yeah, so the way it works is like if you win uh the overall series, so after five days of racing, if you win that, you go straight to a final, then the others go to a semi-final, and then some go to a quarter final. So I just wait until I see who gets through the semi-final, and then I go against them. So they've had a bit of sailing, like they've done some races. Obviously, they have to get through, which is hard, like they have to but whoever meets me has done at least one race, if not two. I don't know if that helps. I think it might help, but I was never I never found myself in that position either. The whole cycle I'd been practiced, because I did it the world championships, I was winning by 60 points, which I think is the most anyone's ever been winning by. And then I came second in the final race. So all all cycle I'd been trying to practice this like final meta race, working with psychologists, trying to work out like what what it is, not going wrong, but like something wasn't clicking in that final race. And yeah, I don't know. I guess I really felt like the games I'd kind of done everything I could to try and prepare myself for that. And yeah, now I wish I didn't make that one mistake in the meta race, but actually at the same time, I think I did an interview after the race and I said I basically said what I felt was honest, and I said I don't think the format's fair, and actually now they are changing it and they're trying to change it. And I mean, if I did anything and made them think about like maybe can change the format, or just I think just respecting like the athlete that I guess I've been full-time for 11 years now as a professional athlete and just trying to respect the athlete's journey and giving out the medals as fairly as possible. That's what I was trying to say. Obviously, the media, I don't know, they loved it and blew out of proportion a little bit, but yeah, that's what I was trying to say.

John Wilson:

And did you have support from other athletes and other teams within because obviously you were uh very much disadvantaged by that and it impacted you, but uh what was the kind of feeling across the sport?

Emma Wilson:

Yeah, I mean, everyone was amazing, and I think like everyone felt for me, even the thing is the Italian girl who won, we've been friends since we were little, like 12, and I was super happy for her. Like, if it could have gone to anyone, like she's one of the nicest people. The last thing I wanted to do was take away like how she was like, she must be feeling amazing, and that was her moment. But yeah, like I had super good support and the team, the team at British Sailing, like yeah, I remember coming in and everyone was crying, and I was like, Oh no, I'm crying, you're crying, everyone's crying. Yeah, it meant a lot to them as well. And yeah, I guess winning the worlds this year kind of felt like I'd paid it back to everyone.

John Wilson:

Yeah, absolutely. Yeah, you you did hint at the time as well about the fact that you might walk away from the sport after kind of that result and what you know, yeah, I guess not in the heat of the moment, but obviously an emotional time. So why didn't you? And I and I guess what at what point did you then think, no, actually I'm gonna kind of go again and I am gonna stick at it?

Emma Wilson:

Yeah, I guess after the games, I took a break, like probably everyone does. And uh I actually went on holiday and I was trying to book a flight back to come here, and every time I booked it, I was like, ah nah, I'm alright, I'm just staying on holiday. So I think I went on holiday for about two months. And then I came back. I didn't really wind surf, but I kind of kept fit and I was just trying to work out like what is my reason for if I'm gonna carry on, like what is my reason for carrying on? Because for me now, after that experience, I don't really feel like it's about medals. I think it completely changed my way of looking at it. And Nana did some work with like the local kids and just like getting them into windsurfing and and just went windsurfing for fun a little bit and realized that I love windsurfing, and also like if I could make a difference to these kids, like I mean I showed them my medals and their eyes like light up, they can't believe it. They don't care what colour it is. Like, I mean, even going to the Olympics is like incredible. So I guess yeah, I I'm I'm really lucky like to have my coach um able to be really honest with him. And yeah, I guess I just said like for me now it's not about winning medals, but trying to push to the sport's limits. And that's what I kind of done all year, like trying to just see how far I can go with the sport. Like I guess watching the boys really helps me, and then also just trying to inspire. I didn't want to quit either straight after because I didn't want kind of didn't want world sailing to beat me. Even if I was gonna quit, I quit on my own terms. And and then yeah, this year's gone really well, just I guess just taking it a bit less seriously and not seriously, but just trying to enjoy the actual sport rather than I don't know, winning medals. Um yeah, trying to keep that way of thinking.

John Wilson:

And yet you have had the most extraordinary year, as you say. So you won the Princess Sophia Trophy, you won the world title, and then you also have world number one ranking. That is fascinating, isn't it, to see that you've almost come back and then dominated the sport. Does it does that feel good for you, you know, psychologically, of like knowing you you've absolutely shown that you're number one in the world?

Emma Wilson:

Yeah, I mean it's it's cool, definitely. And I feel like kind of all the hard work I'd me, my coach, all the training partners have put in for the last four years is like starting to pay off now. Um, maybe a year late, but yeah, it was yeah, like really cool. And I I think I just have been really enjoying it for what it is rather than just taking it super seriously and thinking about winning. I guess I just came with a more relaxed attitude because I was like, oh everyone thinks I'm gonna mess it up anyway. So I just keep trying. And if I don't mess it up, then what that's great. But also just having a good time with the friends and yeah, I think yeah, that's been really helpful.

John Wilson:

It's so important, isn't it? I was thinking about your family as well. I see your mum and dad, because I think as a parent, obviously they want for your success, but to see your child heartbroken, devastated, the unjustice of it, I can only imagine the emotions they must have felt kind of post-paris. Was it Marse Marseille? Was it Marseille, wasn't it?

Emma Wilson:

Yeah, it was Marseille, yeah. Yeah, I think it yeah, it I think it shook everyone a bit. And I'm not sure. My mum was definitely like, you don't have to carry around, like just make sure you're doing it because you want to do it, not just because like you feel like you have to, or and actually the British sailing was super supportive. They were like, you can have a year off, you can you can do whatever you want, kind of thing. Um they're always gonna be there. But I guess I just kind of really like windsurfing and competitive and kind of just I guess I felt like I had some unfinished business. I really wanted to show what I was capable of, and I feel like this year I I kind of have.

John Wilson:

Absolutely. And I I think it's interesting to remember sure. I mentioned that, me watching the Foylin and thinking it just looks like people are flying. It looks almost effortless, and I absolutely realise it's not. So, what does a typical training week look like for you? Maybe now, or or as you're building towards you're back now building towards Europeans, I think. So what what does training look like for you on a week-to-week basis?

Emma Wilson:

Yeah, so we're like based in Weymouth and Portland, which is really good because you can kind of windsurf every day. Like we have wind pretty much every day. So normally we do like Monday to Friday on the water, and then and then in the afternoons of that, we either go to a gym or go cycling. They kind of do cycling as like the fitness site, and then the gym just to stay strong enough to not get injured for the cra crashing, and then on Saturday. Saturday or you do one session, kind of choose windsurfing, side, gym, whatever you want to do. I guess it's intense, but also probably like most professional athletes, it's you're trying to be the best in the world and yeah, trying to trying to do as much training but also be able to recover and not do too much. I guess for me it's always been probably trying not to do too much because I just quickly could spend a million hours out there and um then be exhausted the next day and wonder why. So I think the team around me try and try and keep a lid on me most of the times. But no, it's good.

John Wilson:

And when you say you're on the water, how long are you on the water for when you go out to do a session?

Emma Wilson:

It depends a bit on the wind, but normally like two to three hours on the water. The less windy it is, the more like physical we pump a lot, so it's like super intense and like high heart rate. So then you tend to do a little bit less. And then if it's windy, it's more like holding on to something that's trying to pull you over. So there's a bit more strength involved. So yeah, it's kind of like trying to be good at all around is the goal.

John Wilson:

And how much does the sports science and the technology change the way you prepare, if you compare that with what your mum was doing when she was competing?

Emma Wilson:

Yeah, I mean, now like for me, all my sessions are tracked and they go straight to the physiologist that we have, and he like looks at them and and then he can like plan our next session. And whilst I don't think my mum had any of that, like I'm not sure if she had a heart rate monitor or not. And I think she said, like, my dad did a lot of her fitness program for her. Yeah, I guess it's probably pretty different now. Like, even now we have technology where you can see how fast I'm hitting the start line at and stuff like that, which yeah, I'm pretty sure she didn't have any of that. So yeah, I mean, fair play to her.

John Wilson:

Do you watch videos? Is that much footage of her competing in the 80s and 90s?

Emma Wilson:

Uh I don't know. She sent I actually went to LA in the summer this year, and then she sent because she competed there, and she sent me some pictures when I was out there. But I've only seen pictures, I think, yeah, of her competing in oh, it's funny, like the weird coloured wetsuits and stuff. It's funny to look like.

John Wilson:

It's very fashionable in the 80s, you know, yeah. Yeah.

Emma Wilson:

Apparently.

John Wilson:

And you mentioned that the world championships are coming to Weymouth next year, so you're home base. How special will that be for you?

Emma Wilson:

Yeah, I mean it it's super cool, I think. I mean, obviously I was really young when the London Olympics were on, but now we use like all that base as our training centre. So yeah, to have everyone come to Weymouth where I've trained my whole life. Yeah, it'd be really cool, I think. I don't know, pretty pretty exciting, and I really hope I can do well, but yeah, we'll see. I don't know. I think it's just cool to be able to show everyone like where we train and what we do, because it's a pretty amazing place. And yeah, it should be good.

John Wilson:

It is a beautiful place actually. I was down there a couple of months ago for the first time, but walking around the coast and seeing all the kind of remnants, as it were, of of 2012 and the sailing heritage. So yeah, it'd be amazing to get back down there again next year. And obviously, you've got LA 2028 and then maybe even Brisbane 2032 ahead of you. So how do you look to keep that kind of momentum going without burning out? Because obviously that's many years of competing.

Emma Wilson:

Yeah, I think definitely like now I've like realised that I need to take a bit more breaks, like after the like after the world's this year. I had like a month off and just like tried to be normal for a bit. And I think, yeah, like trying to keep that up a bit, trying to chill out when I can. And and then when I do come back to the windsurfing, just making sure I I'm doing it because I love it and um being clear on what I'm trying to get out of it. And I think that's what like I work really well with my coach Sam and another girl with my training partner, she's Scottish, and we have a great like banter going on, which just helps I think the training environment because we're having a laugh every day. Yeah, I think if it was too serious or just about beating each other, I would not enjoy it. So I think yeah, being able to have a laugh and seeing okay, yeah, it is windsurfing, it is our job, but it's not like world-ending. Um, we're pretty lucky to do it. So, yeah, trying to keep that mindset, I think.

John Wilson:

Yeah, I think you're absolutely right. It's so important, isn't it? Keep that balance of the the reality of it all. How have you seen the visibility of of women in the sport change since you've started, or just the sport generally? And I I'm kind of interested to know how much you feel a responsibility to keep driving that profile for women in windsurfing and sailing.

Emma Wilson:

Yeah, I think uh now like the women's fleet. I think at the World Championships we had a hundred girls, and that was quoted as well, so not everyone could come. So I think it's now massively in windsurfing, especially, it's growing and growing, and seeing the young kids go out there every day. I always try and like wherever it's girls or boys, just try and be approachable to the young kids because I feel like that really helps. Like when I was a kid, if someone had come up to me who was two-time Olympic medalists and spoke to me, I would have been like, oh my god. So if I think just trying to like be approachable, and I always try and be a bit like that, and I don't want to seem scary like to the people. And I don't know, I'm a massive fan of sport in general. And see, I like I watched Keely Hodgkinson on the weekend, and I get inspiration from that, like seeing I mean, she just missed out on gold, but I could relate a lot, you know, to what she was saying, and even like the Women's World Cup. I went to watch one of the matches, and it's pretty cool how like women's sport now has come a long, long way, and yeah, I hope I can be part of that too.

John Wilson:

Excellent. Where do you um where do you go to you for the World Cup? Do you go to the Bristol, one of the Bristol games? Oh or Sandy Park. Yeah, Sandy Park. Brilliant. Yeah, it's been amazing. The atmosphere's been incredible, isn't it?

Emma Wilson:

Yeah, no, it's fully packed.

John Wilson:

Um, you've said that you want to be the best Olympic World windsurfer of all time, I've heard you quoted. So what for you, what does that legacy look like? What do you hope people will look back on your career?

Emma Wilson:

I hope people see me as someone who is determined and gave it everything, but also with a smile on a face and enjoyed the sport for what it is. And if I could inspire some people along the way, that would be a win for me. And obviously I would love to win win some more things, but even if I don't do that and I've inspired people, I've given my athlete best, I think I'll be happy. Yeah, I want to try and change the game a bit. I've always thought like the men's windsurfing is always they've always said it's a bit better, a bit faster. But I guess I just want to see how much we can get to that and how much I can push to sport. And that really inspires me like every day to try and see how good I can be.

John Wilson:

And will you stay in the sport, do you think, when you eventually stop competing?

Emma Wilson:

Yeah, I really hope I can help in some way. I'm not sure what I'm gonna do next. And I guess sometimes you do think about it and you're like, oh god. But um, yeah, I really hope I can at least give back some of what I've learnt. I really think I could help a lot of people actually, like, even if it's just like the journey. And I think there's a lot of times as an athlete, you feel, especially the individual sport, you're not really sure which way to go. And it is hard, like you have to make some big decisions. And I mean, if I could help some people like that, yeah.

John Wilson:

And just finally, what do you hope a young girl, 11, 12-year-old girl watching you today would would take away from your journey? What would you kind of advise would you give them getting started in the sport?

Emma Wilson:

Yeah, I would just say to make sure you're going out there and having fun. You don't have to go and do a million reps of something or do exactly what the the RWA program is telling you. Okay, they're probably not gonna like that, but you don't have to be like strict, you know, you can just go and mess around on water with your mates, eat some sweets. And I think as long as you keep that along the way, and yeah, like in the sessions, try as hard as you can, give everything, but you can definitely have a laugh along the way. And I think, yeah, that's what I've done, and I don't want to lose that. I hope, yeah, more people can be like that.

John Wilson:

Wow, talking to Emma really does make me feel like perhaps I should get over to that lake to try foiling sometime soon myself. If you'd like to hear from other trailblazers like Emma, there are over 200 episodes of The Game Changes.women.co.uk. Guests include elite athletes, Olympians, Paralympians, along with entrepreneurs, coaches, broadcasters, scientists, journalists and CEOs. All women who are changing the game in sport. As well as listening to all the podcasts on the website, you can also find out more about the Women's Sport Collective, a free, inclusive community for all women working in sport. We now have over 14,000 members across the world, so please do come and join us. The whole of my book, Game On, The Unstoppable Rise of Women's Sport, is also free to listen to on the podcast. Every episode of Series 13 is me reading a chapter of the book. A big thank you to Sport England for backing the Game Changers and the Women's Sport Collective with a National Lottery Award. Thank you also to Sam Walker at What Goes On Media, who does such an excellent job as our executive producer, and thank you to my brilliant colleague at Fearless Women, Kate Hannon. You can find the Game Changers on all podcast platforms, and please do follow us now to ensure you don't miss out on future episodes. Do come and say hello on social media where you'll find me on LinkedIn and Instagram at Sue Anstiss. The Game Changers. Fearless Women in Sport.

Head Shot

Sue Anstiss

Host
Head Shot

Sam Walker

Producer