The Game Changers
In this award-winning podcast Sue Anstiss talks to trailblazers in women sport. These are the individuals who are knocking down barriers and challenging the status quo for women and girls everywhere. Along with openly sharing their historic careers, what drives them and how they’ve dealt with tough challenges, each episode explores key issues for equality in sport and beyond.
We’re incredibly grateful to Sport England who support The Game Changers through a National Lottery award.
You can find out about all the guests at https://www.fearlesswomen.co.uk/thegamechangers
Fearless Women in Sport
The Game Changers
Stef Reid: Pioneering progress in Parasports and beyond
In this final episode of series 17, Sue Anstiss talks to Stef Reid, a remarkable para-athlete who has spent her life breaking boundaries.
Stef is a track and field Paralympian - a World Champion, four-time Paralympian, triple Paralympic medallist and five-time world record holder.
Having retired from the track in 2022 Stef now works as a keynote speaker, broadcaster and executive coach, also turning her hand to modelling and acting.Steph was the first amputee to walk the London Fashion Week catwalk and starred in the British reality TV show Dancing on Ice in 2022.
This is an extraordinary conversation with a truly inspiring woman.
Thank you to Sport England who support The Game Changers Podcast with a National Lottery award.
Find out more about The Game Changers podcast here: https://www.fearlesswomen.co.uk/thegamechangers
Hosted by Sue Anstiss
Produced by Sam Walker, What Goes On Media
A Fearless Women production
Hello and welcome to the Game Changers. I'm Sue Anstiss, and this is the podcast where you'll hear from trailblazing women in sport who are knocking down the barriers and challenging the status quo for women and girls everywhere. What can we learn from their journeys as we explore key issues around equality in sport and beyond? I'd like to start with a big thank you to our partner, sport England, who support the Game Changers through a National Lottery Award. My guest today is Steph Reid MBE, a para-athlete who has spent her life breaking boundaries A world champion, four-time Paralympian, triple Paralympic medalist and five-time world record holder.
Sue Anstiss:Having retired from the track in St, now works as a keynote speaker, broadcaster, executive coach and also turning her hand to modelling and acting. Steph was the first amputee to walk the London Fashion Week catwalk and took part in Dancing on Ice in 2022, making it to the quarterfinals and showing the world that you can learn to skate with an artificial foot. Steph, you have done so many things in life, so I just wonder what do you say today when you're asked to introduce yourself?
Stef Reid:It's always a tricky one, because I feel like how you would introduce yourself a year ago, five years ago, was so different from how you introduce yourself now, and I think that's just part of the fun with life. You don't have to be one thing forever. You can keep evolving, and that's fine, and that's normal.
Sue Anstiss:That's great, that's absolutely true, isn't it Just not one thing forever Taking you back in history? You had a very international upbringing, so can you give us a bit more background about your family life and where you lived as you grew up?
Stef Reid:Yes. So for anyone who is currently confused by my accent, it was really international. I had two parents who both worked in the hospitality industry and they just knew from a young age they wanted to conquer the world. They wanted to explore it and they did. That was part of the benefit of being in hospitality that you could travel, and they went everywhere, from Africa to Hawaii to Canada. I was actually born in New Zealand. They were out there on a contract. Mom got pregnant, thought this is beautiful, we'll stay and have stuff here and anyways. Eventually we did settle in Canada. So my older sister was born in Canada and we moved there. When I was four, so predominantly grew up there. I met my husband. We fell in love. He's from the French part of Canada, but at the time he was living in Dallas Texas. So I lived in Dallas Texas for a few years, but then we moved back to the UK in 2010 and settled here.
Sue Anstiss:And was sport always a part of your life and a sense of your identity as you were growing?
Stef Reid:up. I cannot remember a moment when sport wasn't there. Actually, one of my very, very first sporting memories was actually being we lived in Hawaii for a bit and I remember watching the Ironman triathlon on TV in Hawaii and just being fascinated with it and just fascinated with this idea that we could compete and train and keep improving. And I just, I just love that aspect. If I don't want to clean my room, my mom would just say, well, let's see if you can clean it in you know seven minutes and beat it from that. That was it. I was gone and I was cleaning it, and so it's just always been a part of who I am.
Sue Anstiss:And you played rugby in Canada, so quite a high level, I believe. So what was it that you loved about the sport?
Stef Reid:Rugby is just, it's like nothing else. I mean, I grew up playing all sorts of sports and so I loved basketball and volleyball, cross-country swimming, did some ballet, and then, when I was 13, I was introduced to rugby and for me it was just oh, it was this sport where, for the first time, it was okay to be crazy aggressive and super competitive and it wasn't like, oh, you know, let's just tone that down a little bit, that's not what little girls should do. It was like, you know, yes, more of that, go for it. And it was just the first time I was on this pitch and I was running down and I was covered in mud and I was just free to let it all out. And that part I love. But also the other part was it was just, it was the game that perfectly showcased all of my skills as an athlete. That was it.
Sue Anstiss:And Canada are doing really well actually now, aren't they? I don't know how much you still follow international women's rugby, but they really are kind of progressing fast on that pathway. Where was rugby at the time when you were playing? Where were Canada in terms of a national team?
Stef Reid:I was so lucky in that I happened to grow up in Toronto so a big city and we just happened to have a PE teacher at our school who played to quite a high level. That's the only reason why we had any sort of rugby team. It's not something, it was very unusual and so I was very lucky at that time. And then we're talking back in 1998. So still in the early days of it Excellent.
Sue Anstiss:And you saw your future as a rugby player. That was the kind of pathway of the different sports you tried. You weren't about to go and do Ironman at that young age, but the different sports it was rugby that you were kind of set on in terms of a pathway.
Stef Reid:I did so, the PE teacher at our school. She went and she played rugby at the university level and I had in the back of my mind well, maybe, maybe I'll go back to New Zealand and I will go to university there, because I was good in Canada but I didn't know if I was good compared to the rest of the world and I wanted to explore and I thought, well, you know, I'd love to give it a shot. So in grade six, when I was 12, we had to write out our goals for our yearbook and I had three. Number one was to be an Olympian. Number two was to win American Gladiators American because I was living in North America. And number three was to be an actress. So those were that's where my those are my priorities when I was 12.
Sue Anstiss:I love that and you had, I guess, so much ambition and goals for life, but that all changed for you at the age of 15, it's a formative time for, uh, young women everywhere. Really are you happy to share what happened in the background there?
Stef Reid:yeah, of course um, I, I had actually caught the eye of of some of the national coaches. You know they're impressed with my skills. Just still, I, I was a little bit small. I mean I was a scrum half, so I wasn't, I wasn't in in the scrum, but you know they're very impressed, but my skills, just still, I was a little bit small. I mean I was a scrum half, so I wasn't in the scrum, but you know they're very impressed. But just thought, you know you need to do a little bit more growing before we're going to unleash you with some very powerful women. But it genuinely looked like this ridiculous dream actually had a shot at coming true and it was exciting. Had a shot at coming true, and it was exciting.
Stef Reid:And then, in August of 2000, just before my 16th birthday, everything changed in an instant. I was up at a friend's cottage for the bank holiday weekend and they had a beautiful cottage on the lake and they had a powerboat. And just before my parents were going to arrive to pick me up that morning, I thought, guys, let's go tubing one last time. I had loved it, it was so much fun. And so we all hopped on the boat and we went and I was on the tube. Tubing is when you are attached to a rubber tube and you're pulled by the boat, and I had hit a wave and fallen off as you do totally normal and I was waiting for the boat to come back and pick me up, like it always did. But on that occasion there had been a miscommunication between the spotter and the driver and the driver had no idea I was in the water and didn't see me and unfortunately I was run over and caught in the propellers.
Sue Anstiss:And I mean imagine you can't even imagine what that must have been like as a young woman to have kind of faced that in your life. That process then, in terms of the recovery and rebuilding, how hard was that both physically and psychologically for you building.
Stef Reid:How hard was that, both physically and psychologically. For you, it is the hardest thing I have done in my life. I mean it's it's. The propellers caught my lower back and my right leg and I I knew how unbelievably lucky I was to survive that it's. It's not an accident that people would normally survive, but unfortunately my right leg, my right foot, couldn't be saved and I had to be amputated. And for anyone that is, you know, a life-changing accident. But for me, as thankful as I was to still be alive, my first thought was well, how am I supposed to play rugby if I can't run? And my second thought was I'm not actually sure I want this life.
Sue Anstiss:And how does a young woman and your family around you kind of deal? How do you come from that to not just where you are now but even in those early weeks and months? I can't you know imagine that kind of process that is needed.
Stef Reid:I'm so glad that you said you know me and my family, because I think so often the focus is just on the person it happens to, but it's every single person is affected and my experience I actually think it is harder somebody looking in from the outside, because I know what I can handle and I know what I'm capable of. But you know, for my mom, who's constantly worried, is she not telling me how she feels because she doesn't want me to feel badly? You have all those questions and so it was. Everybody had to adjust and you know it was my best friends on the boat that watched that happen and that's just your entire network that's been affected and there's no easy answers, there's no shortcut. But there definitely was a defining moment.
Stef Reid:It was seven days after the accident and a nurse came into my room and you know, at this point I wasn't a very nice person, for obvious reasons. I was miserable, I was in pain, I wasn't eating, I didn't want to see people. I, you know, at this point I wasn't a very nice person, for obvious reasons. I was miserable, I was in pain, I wasn't eating, I didn't want to see people. I, you know, was just, you could probably say, checked out of the situation. At that point I just didn't care anymore and I told her I wasn't going to eat that day and I closed my eyes, hoping she'd get the hint and she would just go. But when I opened them again, she was still there and she was looking directly at me and she said really kindly but very firmly Stephanie, it's time. It is time to move forward. Others have done it and you can too. And that was shocking to me because you know I was sad and I just had a life-changing injury. You know I had earned this pity party. I can't believe you're judging me standing there with your two feet Like this is my right.
Stef Reid:But the thing is I couldn't stop thinking about her because she was the first person who walked into that room and didn't feel sorry for me. Instead, she laid down a challenge and I mean that is a nurse with a lot of wisdom, because that is a risky strategy. But I think that's someone who had seen people in this situation her entire life and she read the situation right and she just spoke to that athletic part of me. That part of the reason I love sport was it was a challenge and I could have lost every limb of my body and that part of me wouldn't have changed. I would still be someone who loves challenge, and it has to be redirected. At that point, sport did not look like an option, but that was a spark. Things were not perfect after that. It wasn't like it was all rosy. There was still a long way to go, but that was the moment I decided actually I'm going to try.
Sue Anstiss:And at what point? How long did it take from that point with meeting that nurse and that change of shift in your thought process to actually being in a place where you could even contemplate sport and physical activity?
Stef Reid:It was a while I had these glorious images and Hollywood ideas of how I was going to return to the rugby field next year and not just be as good, I was going to be better, I was going to do it in record time, and you know all of that and that just isn't the reality. And yeah, they're cool and they're fast, but actually just the process of if you no longer have a foot, you are now basically running on bones and skin that aren't designed to take that kind of pressure, and actually that was my biggest issue my stump just couldn't handle those kind of forces that would break down. It was incredibly painful and you know, running is not fun when it's painful. And so actually, my first experience of sport as thrilled as I was to get back to it, it just wasn't a reality at that point and that was something I had to accept and I had to almost grieve that dream and let it go. But it's okay, because there were new dreams and I, you know I was still going to be Steph, this person who loved competing, and I thought, okay, well, you know what, what are the options? And so I I joined the chess club and, you know, could play chess and games. I joined the trivia team. As you can see I was.
Stef Reid:I was very cool in high school and we would go and we would compete and it was great and I just I found a new path and actually I loved academia Again. It was another challenge and it was another avenue to, you know, still be competitive in a different sense, and so I'd actually just kind of shifted. All that energy, all the time I used to spend training for athletics or for sport, I now invested in my schoolwork and I wanted to be a surgeon. Dr Crater, who saved my life, I thought he was amazing. He was amazing and I thought, if I could do that like that, that's a great life. And so that was my new goal. I was, I got a full scholarship to study biochemistry. I was going to go to med school and it would still be a great life.
Sue Anstiss:And so where did they kind of transition into sport and athletics, track and field come?
Stef Reid:So in my first year at university, there was a girl on my dorm, fiona, who was going to try out for the athletics team. She was a hurdler and it just happened to coincide with when I had a new blade and it was also a few years now from the accident and I was told that your skin will toughen up, your bone will eventually adapt. It's just not going to happen overnight. And she was going and I just thought I wonder how fast I still am On the rugby pitch. I'm not the biggest person in the world. I was lucky, I was fast, that was my thing.
Stef Reid:I had never really done athletics to a high level, but I thought, well, this could be interesting. And so I called the head coach, who must have thought I was nuts, basically said hi, I had to leave a message. This is Steph, I'd love to come and try. I don't really know anything about athletics, but I'd love to try and, by the way, I'm an amputee and and hung up and he called back and he was just like.
Stef Reid:I know nothing about it either, but if you're willing to come and you commit, then basically we won't cut you, even though you have absolutely no way of making any sort of team standard and that was the start and you know he wasn't intimidated at all by it. He was more than happy for me to come and try and it took a while. It took until my fourth year at university when I finally made the actual team in the travel standard and that was quite exciting. I mean, I was competing able-bodied. We didn't really have a para division or anything like that, but it was four years and the work really did. It really did pay off.
Sue Anstiss:And then obviously, you went on to have the most extraordinary career in terms of being a para athlete. You won bronze in the 200 meters at beijing games in 2008 and silver long jump in london 2012, and you competed first for canada and then for great britain. So why the change in in who you represented?
Stef Reid:so I hold three passports. I have a new zealand passport because I was born there. I have a british passport through my parents and I have a canadian passport through, uh, naturalization and and living there, and and do you know what? It's such a funny question for me because I remember when I was making this decision initially and actually at the time I was living in Dallas, texas, and a lot of people saying I just don't understand how you can change the country that you compete for. You know, but like, who are you really, like, which country do you belong to? And I don't know how to answer that because I've just always had three. And you know, for me it's just not a question of, it's just my reality. And so it is still a question that I had to consider. But for me, the most important factor at the end of the day was I knew that for me to reach my full potential, I needed to be in London, and that was for the very amazing reason that London 2012 was hosting, and I started my career late.
Stef Reid:I was in my mid-20s, I didn't have time and London 2012, this was the first time that a sports program in a country was committed to investing equally. Our head coach at the time, or the head coach at Great Britain at the time, peter Erickson had this phrase in athletics the same, the same, the same. Every single Paralympian will have access to every tool, every coach, every facility. And obviously there was a catch. He just said you know, my expectations will be the same. You guys better perform and this better be you. You know you need to show the professionalism, but I thought, if I ever want to find out what my potential is, it was an easy choice. Um, it needed to. I needed to be in the UK.
Sue Anstiss:And how was that? I mean, we talk still, don't we, so much about London 2012, but as an athlete and kind of being on that incredible stage, what are your core memories that you have from that experience?
Stef Reid:Oh man, it was for me. In many ways, it was such a gamble. So I graduated from biochemistry, I sat my MCAT, I did well, but I ended up pursue this ridiculous dream to be a professional sprinter with one foot. Or am I going to go to medical school and do something very sensible, very respectable? And you have to remember I had to make this decision at a time 2006. This is well before London 2012 hadn't happened. Nobody knew what the Paralympics were and people thought I was crazy. Why would you do that? But I just never wanted to be in a situation where I thought but what, if, what? If I end up sitting at home watching this, regretting it In a medical school, it will always be there. I can always go back. But this has a time limit and curiosity got the better of me, and I think experiencing London 2012 like that don't I mean Beijing 2008 was amazing as well, that was amazing, but London 2012, and I don't know if it's because I was a home athlete, but talking to other international athletes, they agree, london 2012 was amazing across the board and it was just. It was this moment where, well, I would say, three things really came together.
Stef Reid:You need three things if you were going to see a burst in interest in the Paralympics. One, you need sponsorship. You have to have companies. You have to have people that are willing to invest, because there's no way around it Becoming a great athlete having the finances to have the coach and the training facilities it costs money. There's absolutely no way around it.
Stef Reid:Two, you need to have the media and trust. That really matters and Channel 4 got behind it and, you know, just took it in a completely different direction, like, for me, the billboards. You know, thanks for the warm-up Olympics Well done. You know, for years Olympics had been like on the pedal stool in the Paralympics for like the ugly stepsister, and they flipped it and it was so fantastic and it was great. But the third thing you need is you need athletes performing and again we had so many athletes at that Games. It's such a high caliber. All those three things combined just captured the imagination of Great Britain and the world and it really was the launch of a new era for Paralympics. We're not there yet, but we're definitely in a new era.
Sue Anstiss:It does feel as if your career as a Paralympic athlete has almost mirrored that growth in in the paralympics and para sport and so on, and I guess that's across 18 years, isn't it? So you really have seen from one to to where it is now. You it's interesting that you say you're not, we're not quite there yet. I guess what more would you like to see? You're now almost on the other side of it in terms of commentating and so on, but what more do we need to see?
Stef Reid:That is a great question and I wish I had the full answer so I could go out and correct it right now. But you are right, I just think I am so lucky in terms of timing and I really did have the privilege of watching. I remember my first meets at small high school tracks where there's literally no one there, just my mom at the end of the 100 meter start line with a hot pink sign go, steph, go and that's it. But that was fine, I loved it. I didn't have a bigger expectation. But then, in the space of a really short time, being thrust onto the world stage and just seeing the evolution in so many ways, I remember starting and people oh, look at her, that is so sweet. Look at her trying, well done.
Stef Reid:To the opposite end of the spectrum, where you know you're having these conversations and narratives about blades. Actually it's cheating, actually it's too much of an advantage. You can't compete against able-bodied, you can't compete in the Olympics Discussions that Marcus Rehm from Germany, for example, is having. So I think you know, in some ways I'm like we're not there yet, but in other ways I think, my goodness, it's rare you see something evolve this quickly In terms of what still needs to happen with parasport. I think the obvious answer is we need more media coverage, we need more finances in the world of parasport, but actually I think even before that we still have not reached the entire world when it comes to para sport.
Stef Reid:There are still countries that are just coming to the forefront, and I was just commentating at the World Parathletics Championships in Kobe in Japan and, my goodness, india is coming on.
Stef Reid:They are investing what we saw from the athletes there. That is exciting, and when that gets around to all of India, there's going to be another explosion. And so what we have at the moment in parasport is a sport that keeps evolving, because it has to. We keep seeing just new athletes coming and you have to watch and you have to adjust, and you have to adjust in terms of the program and what's on offer, and it is this kind of working puzzle, but it's so exciting. And it is this kind of working puzzle but it's so exciting. And the other thing that's really difficult is that the reality is there are certain expenses to parasport that can make the barrier really difficult. So, particularly if you look at the cost of racing wheelchairs or prosthetic legs, which again it can be a barrier for other parts in the world, and once we start seeing those break down, then it is just going to explode again and I'm excited for that.
Sue Anstiss:And you retired in 2022, I believe I love what you said on the time. I think it's in your Instagram post, but you said retirement feels like an entirely the wrong word. I think evolution fits much better. It doesn't feel like an ending or a beginning, but more like a redirection. So what did you mean by that at the time, and do you still feel that way two years on?
Stef Reid:Oh, I do so much so I think I noticed it. When people will sometimes ask you well, what was your favorite games? I'm just like I don't have one. It's impossible to have one because it's impossible to compare them, because I was a different person going into each one. 2008, so new, absolutely no clue what was going on. Wildly different experience. 2012, for the first time in my life, huge pressure. I'd never had sponsors. I'd never have that sort of expectation to perform. Wildly different experience 2016, different again gold medal pressure. And what do you do in that scenario? Tokyo, oh my goodness, just the two years. No one could have predicted our experience so wildly different across it.
Stef Reid:And when I decided to retire in June 2022, it was the first time in my life where it actually felt like pursuing some of my interests outside of sport was the scarier option. I think some people were surprised I didn't carry on until Paris 2024. My coach was actually a little bit surprised because he was like it was one of your best performances in Tokyo. You jumped so well in this just three years. I wasn't injured, I was still funded, but I just thought I, at this moment in time, stepping out and trying to make a name for myself as a broadcaster, as a keynote speaker, as an executive coach. That actually felt scarier, and I just knew that is. Then, for me, fear is such a great marker in terms of what you should be doing, and the moment I feel it I'm like, oh well, now I'm going to have to do it, and that, very much, was my experience.
Sue Anstiss:That's really interesting, isn't it? I was going to ask you because we are, in a positive way, talking more about the challenge for athletes of coming to the end of their sporting careers, and I wondered how much you did miss that. So I want to come on to talk about all that you've gone on to do, but what did you miss about being a full time athlete?
Stef Reid:And was that a difficult transition? You've made that decision, but then letting go of it how, how difficult was that for you? It was hard in ways I was not expecting. So. So, as I said it was, it was one of those decisions. That was fully my choice.
Stef Reid:I chose this, which is why I was so unprepared for the amount of grieving that had to take place. I mean, I was an utter disaster for a significant like, to the point where I had to think quite carefully about who I was going to spend my time with, because at any moment I could burst into tears and I had to make sure this is a person who would not be weirded out by that. And so, and it was just, it was just random, and I realized, as I was going through it, one I'm glad I feel this much grief because it just means I loved what I did. I loved every moment of it, and even though I chose to move on, that's almost two decades of my life that I've dedicated to this, this one thing, and it was just this. You know, I had to just respect that time and my feelings and I really was putting to rest that part of myself. But when you put to rest, part of yourself or part of yourself dies. It's almost like I've been gardening a lot lately, can you tell? It's like an analogy, for now something else can grow. It's so cheesy and sad, but there you go, and so in that process I didn't realize how much of my time and my brain space had been dedicated to athletics until I stepped out of it and again it was this like rebirth, and that I loved. But the thing is as well.
Stef Reid:I think possibly the hardest thing for me in this process has just been you go from being objectively the best in the world at something to not, and the only way. You start from the bottom again, and that's hard because you've been used to having this, you know privileged status, and now it's gone. But that's the reality in life. Everybody experiences that If you want to climb a new peak, then you've got to walk down from the one that you're on and adjusting to that and remembering what it's like to do.
Stef Reid:You know what. I've been here before. I had to work my way up several times and I'll do it again, and I think sometimes it's just horror because I'm like well, I'm in my late thirties, I'm supposed to have my life together. But now I'm starting this new, this whole new thing, and I'm suddenly realizing there are skill sets, you learn some things really well as an athlete, and then there are some serious deficits when you leave. It was just getting my head around that, but I was so lucky that I had some fantastic support, actually by one of the lifestyle advisors, julie Smith, who you know was totally fine with me coming in for 60 minutes and just crying and then I would leave and then we'd make a little bit of progress. But that's the reality of what it's like.
Sue Anstiss:It's it's hard and one of the, the lifestyle advisors for UK sport, for EIS, as it were. Yes, yeah, yeah, yeah. And you taught then, I guess, that doing those things, those new things and you have done so many extraordinary things as an athlete. And then since, um and I mentioned some in the intro about being a model at London Fashion Week, you did a photo shoot for Debenhams that was in Vogue, you were semi-finalist in MasterChef, and there are many things that would just terrify most people the thought of being in the public eye, not just doing something new, but doing something new in such a public place too. So I love that you talk about that fear and you've clearly truly embraced that. I did hear a lovely piece that you said in an interview trying is beautiful and people should never afraid to be a beginner, which so resonates with me. So I just wonder are there challenges that you've turned down? Are there things that you've said no to for whatever reason?
Stef Reid:Oh, do you know what? I have a hard time saying no. I kind of have a policy where it's like I'll say yes to everything once Most of it is. I just look at it, I think, is this going to be fun? And does this scare me? Those are normally the two things that I'm like. If it's yes, then this is just going to happen. I did Okay, so I did turn down the jump and no, I'll never forget, because, again, that for me was I was still competing and I thought I would never too many people have invested too much into my career.
Stef Reid:I could never turn around and be like, oh, I'm really sorry I got hurt doing this, but I'll never forget looking at one of the producers and saying you know, is this dangerous? No, not really. And you're like oh, you know, know, you have to learn for yourself quite quickly how to assess things. Um, so, yeah, I mean, I, I do. I do have some standards and you know, I do have a the question of, okay, is this wise? But my, my primary markers are is it fun and am I scared of it?
Sue Anstiss:and have those always been your sentiments. So having that, that belief in that attitude, is that. Have you had that throughout your career? Has that been with you for a long, long time, or is that something that's evolved over time?
Stef Reid:I think it's probably something that's been with me for a while. I do love adrenaline. I am a risk taker, which is probably why my husband, brent, prefers to do the investing over me. I just think you know you have to. Actually it was a lesson that I learned quite young. You know, my parents were. They were entrepreneurs and I watching someone like that grow up and you see you get big wins and there's big losses, and that's okay, you deal with some. There will be a lot of difficult times in life but still, seeing the belief and the positivity, well, we'll just, we'll try again. I think that definitely had an impact on me.
Stef Reid:Just little things like playing Monopoly. Initially think, you know, the best thing to do is keep all my money. But watching my dad, he would get, he'd buy everything he landed on and he would, you know, go into massive debt. But by the end that's when he would, you know, take all of our money. And so I guess it's just these little interesting lessons, that kind of accrue, and you realize actually there's no guarantees in life ever.
Stef Reid:And I, you know, I learned that at 15, thinking, you know, I actually might die. That was when I realized there are no guarantees in life and you can't predict the future. But the absolute best thing that you can ever have in your life is an opportunity, and you don't ever turn down opportunities, even if they don't work out, that doesn't matter. The fact is that you took it, you went in the arena and you tried, and I guess the other thing that my career has taught me.
Stef Reid:A few years ago I was in Nepal and I was being introduced on stage and there's a little bit of a language barrier, which was quite funny. But this gentleman introduced me as Steph Reed, the great winner, and it just made me laugh as I walked on stage because I just thought, statistically, that is so inaccurate. Statistically, I've probably lost 95% of the time. I just happened to win in a few big moments, which is why people then associate you with being a winner. But it just really tickled me and I think we don't talk openly enough about that that actually the process of winning requires a lot, a lot of failing.
Sue Anstiss:Yeah, I've been thinking about that recently, reflecting around Paris and the amount of athletes that either don't get selected or get there but don't get through to it. But we obviously spend so much time celebrating those amazing athletes that do, but realizing others have worked as hard, haven't they? And made as many sacrifices and given as much, but it didn't always come to the same ending.
Stef Reid:Yeah, it's a hard one, and I think so much of I think the narrative. Perhaps in social media is celebrating this idea of ease, like life is going to be easy. And it's never easy. And I remember, even just in high school, I was reasonably gifted academically but I also studied really hard. I mean, it doesn't matter, you can be a genius. I'm sorry, but you will not magically know how to parse a French verb unless you sit down and memorize it. And people you know I would get my mark back and somebody might say something like, oh, that's great, but you know, I bet you studied for it. And I'm like, yeah, of course I studied for it, but it was almost like, well, if you tried, it's just not as cool, and so that for me was just a narrative I never understood. That is just. The reality is, by and large, the person that succeeds in life is a person that fails the most but keeps persevering Fabulous.
Sue Anstiss:Absolutely true. You were also a competitor in dancing on ice when you reached quarterfinals, so was that a tough decision at the time. I feel like knowing you now, talking to you, it's like, oh no, a fabulous challenge. But how tough was that as a decision to take, because that was a really big step physically.
Stef Reid:Oh, do you know what? No, I said yes immediately, Only because I had absolutely no idea what was involved. I thought, yeah, I'll be great, I'm a great athlete, I'm totally going to nail this. And then I started skating and just realized skating, I wasn't a skater, I wasn't a dancer, I wasn't a performer. And skating is a sport that requires really fine proprioception and balance and control in your ankle and your foot, which is not ideal when you are missing one. Again, skating is a sport.
Stef Reid:I had absolutely no biomechanical patterns in my body. Everything happened. I'm used to running in a straight line. In skating, even if you want to go straight, you have to push to the side. Everything happens on curves and it was just.
Stef Reid:There were so many moments where I just thought this is just, this actually just might be a step too far. And that was the reality, and I think you know I am a positive thinker, but I will still be the least bad I can possibly be. That was my commitment, and so I did everything that I could, and I was so lucky because I had the most unbelievable professional partner, Andy, who at first I felt really bad for him. I'm like, oh, this poor guy got stuck with the amputee. He's probably thinking, oh, this is so much work. But I found out a few weeks in. He actually requested me, he actually liked the idea of a challenge and he realized early on because they have a very, very specific way in which they train people. And Andy just tossed it out Because, even though I still couldn't do some of the basic things like stopping, he realized that actually as an athlete you know, I just came back from Tokyo I was fit, I could do some really advanced moves on on one, on one leg, we could do some really cool partner lifts, and so he just really changed the way that he trained me.
Stef Reid:And the crazy thing was I actually got better, and to the point where I was absolutely gutted. When I left I was devastated Because, one, I wanted to have the challenge of the solo skate just because I wanted to prove I could do it. But two, I was like, well then, that's that part of my life over. But I quickly realized well, Dancing Ice doesn't own every rank. So I kept skating and I actually fulfilled my goal. I competed at the British Adult National Championships in March earlier this year and I came second in my category. And I still skate now. I love it Again. It was so hard, and things that are hard just grip me in a way that I can't let go of them now.
Sue Anstiss:I love watching you on Instagram and seeing your training still so more ambitions there, and I've also seen you training for triathlon as well. Do you think you could take part in sport and just enjoy sport, or are you kind of hardwired for those challenges in competition?
Stef Reid:That is such a good question. I think I was curious about how yeah, what would life look like doing sport? Sport was always going to be part of my life, that that was a non-negotiable, and so at the moment, I've done a few triathlons. I discovered parkrun Amazing, love it. But you're right, I really I struggle to go and not do the best that I'm capable of, and so the way that I see it now is I will give my absolute best at every single training session I go to.
Stef Reid:The difference is that I now have about, let's say, five hours to invest in running as opposed to 40. So I will make the most of those five hours and accept that it probably won't be world class, but I just I can't not do my best, because for me, doing your best is part of the fun, and I've also realized that me having fun also correlates with me doing my best. And so it's this really interesting mix, and if I start losing either one of those, then I have to think well, hang on a second. You know why. And if, at any point, I find myself there's been a few times where I've not wanted to go to park run, because I was out late last night and I was worried I wouldn't, you know, beat my PB. I'm like Stephanie, that's the dumbest thing ever. Get out there and go. You're not going to PB every time, otherwise, at some do you have these narratives in your head as an athlete, just as a person, that I don't think I'll ever get rid of and I just, I will always love competing.
Sue Anstiss:And moving on to other things that you're doing, I guess, within life generally, I know you've been in the news recently for calling out Nike over their amputee shoe policy, which is just fascinating, Fascinating to see it kind of not unravel but come to life across social media. Can you tell us a little bit about that and what the outcome has been as well?
Stef Reid:Yeah, so thank you for asking. It was, I mean, that took me off guard. I was not expecting the response that it generated at all. But basically what happened was I was at a park run and I was chatting with one of my friends and I was looking I'm new to road running, I was a sprinter and we were having a bit of a chat about shoes and they have these amazing carbon fiber shoes coming out and I kind of wanted a pair. I was going to wait and you know, once I plateaued, that was my strategy to then get another PB. But a friend pointed out actually you might want to get it now because it's better for your joints and for your foot. And so I went online and I was researching the Alpha Flies and they were about 250, 300 pounds. They're not cheap. And as I was buying them I just thought, oh, this is so ridiculous. I can't believe I'm going to spend this much money when, because I run with a running blade, then those are the kind of shoes you only wear when you're running. I'm literally going to buy this to throw half of it out.
Stef Reid:But then I remembered my sister had sent me a photo. She had been shopping at Nike in North America. She was in a Nike store and they had these incredible mannequins on display and the mannequins had one real leg and one leg with a running blade. It looked just like me, just like my amputation, and I was like this is amazing. I bet Nike will totally get this. I bet they have a policy. And so I wrote in the customer service and I was told, basically, no, we can't accommodate this. I pointed out, but you've got these amazing mannequins. And it was still a no. But they offered me a one-time 15%, so 15, not 50, 15% discount. And I'm like, well, okay, that's great, but the next time I buy shoes I'm still going to have this issue. So it's not really a solution, is it, anyway? So I just posted a reel about it and people responded really, really strongly to it. And anyways, I'm going to cut the story short, no-transcript. And it's actually more common as an adult to have feet that don't match than feet that do.
Stef Reid:And as I was researching it more, I genuinely think the best way, the way that we should be consuming and buying shoes, is having the ability to buy them in singles, because there are so many people, you know, it's one thing, just me lobbying for me to be able to buy shoes at half price, but that's not worth a global campaign. Actually, the number of people, for a variety of reasons, that would like to buy shoes separately but now have to buy two sets of shoes and then just chuck them out, it's huge. And I think that it's just the default in the shoe industry, because it's easy, you know, to simply produce two shoes, whereas it takes some data and some oversight to be able to predict. Well, if we start doing them on separate lines, what does that look like? And it is possible. Shoes are. They're not Kit Kats, they're not made in pairs, they are made on separate lines and it's just the company willing to take that on. And it's important one for cost but two for sustainability.
Stef Reid:And so I've been having this conversation and I've been having some great feedback. Alice and Felix's shoe company. They responded immediately and they've actually introduced an amputee policy. They also have a pregnancy policy, because a lot of women discover that their feet change sizes during pregnancy, so that's amazing. I am having discussions with other shoe companies. I actually can't talk about those right now only because my commitment to them was I would take that conversation offline while they're figuring out their policies, which I think is you know. That's fair. I understand people need time, but it is still moving along and I do hope to have an update soon on that front.
Sue Anstiss:And how exciting to be driving change and, as you say, not just for amputees but for people across the world, for those that might have different challenges, and absolutely, on the pregnancy piece and everything else as well, it's really broadly reaching a huge audience, which you think should be a commercial incentive to those manufacturers as well.
Stef Reid:Well, I do think it's important, and one of the things that I really enjoy with the different exchanges with the shoe companies is that it really has been conversational, and I've never approached Nike. I've never approached any of them being angry Because, honestly, if I wasn't an amputee, I probably wouldn't have thought about it either. I don't for one second think that it was an intentional desire to misrepresent through marketing. I just think no one asked the question. But for me, this is the standpoint that I always come to when I talk about diversity and inclusion. It's not, I mean, okay, you can make the argument for it's the right thing to do, it's a kind thing to do. Put that aside. Actually, it's the best thing to do for business. It makes for a better experience for everyone. It adds value to your business.
Stef Reid:That's where I come from and actually, when you start changing your mindset, you start changing the way you think, you start being willing to see the world differently, through a different lens For example, somebody who's an amputee consuming products. Then you start seeing the world differently, you start seeing different problems and you see different solutions. This kind of thinking is unbelievably powerful and this is what will change the world. There are so many conflicts going on in the world. There are so many conflicts going on in the world right now and so many places where conversations need to be had, but we're just missing each other. And I just think that diverse and inclusive thinking that allows you to consider the needs of everybody around you and to be able to take a perspective not just from your own, but from all these different areas, I think it's unbelievably powerful.
Sue Anstiss:Another area that I was fascinated to see your involvement with is with the leprosy mission. So I wonder if you can give us a little bit of background as to how you came to be involved and what your role is there. And I say, even looking at your Instagram posts, I learned so much just reading and researching from following you. So, yeah, please do share more around that with us.
Stef Reid:The leprosy mission was one of those occasions where, yeah, someone called, I was curious and I thought I'm in and I said, well, do you want us to tell you a bit more about it? No, I'm in, it sounds great, and so basically what they were doing. So the connection is well, okay, I'll take it back. A lot of people think leprosy that's an ancient biblical disease. Surely? No, it's not. Leprosy still exists in the world today and there's absolutely no reason for it, because it is a disease where we have a cure for it. We know how to fix it. It's not even that expensive. It is just a case of identifying it and getting it to the people who need it quickly enough. Because the problem with leprosy is that if it's left untreated, that's when you can get things like amputation, and that's devastating because it's something that didn't need to happen. The solution was so simple, but there's so much stigma surrounding leprosy and it's one of those things where people don't want to say, look, I have it, because they're worried about being excommunicated from their society, and so to say, look, I have it, because they're worried about being excommunicated from their society, and so it's a really, really difficult disease to tackle, but the leprosy mission is doing some amazing, amazing work in that area, and so they asked if I would. They were doing a campaign to raise money and they wanted me to come and host it. And in 2015, there was a big earthquake and it badly damaged one of their flagship hospitals just outside of Kathmandu and so I went there and it was just interesting as well.
Stef Reid:Again, as someone who has a disability and who has many times in her life experienced stigma just actually realizing how difficult it is to overcome that I remember going and knowing leprosy. Yes, it is contagious, but actually, as a healthy Westerner with a robust immune system, you won't contract it. It's only a disease that you will get. You will only ever see it in extreme poverty and extreme malnutrition. Even so, even though I knew that, I found myself hesitating to touch people there and it was just this real wake-up call to me, like as someone that speaks often out against assumptions and stigma, how it affects me, and it was really, really interesting.
Stef Reid:But I love the work that they do, because they raise lots of money but they then give it away to people who are best placed to know how to deal with it. They give it to the countries. They're not coming in and being like, oh, we think you should do this, this and this, and it's just. It's a disease that it's not like cancer. Cancer can affect anybody. You can have people who are billionaires have cancer. That's why you will always have spokespeople for cancer. Leprosy is a disease that you only see in forgotten communities, which is why we rarely see it mentioned in the media, and that's why I am so impressed with the work that Leprosy Mission does.
Sue Anstiss:It's fabulous to see you using your profile and your platform in these ways. I do remember talking to Tanya Gray-Thompson, actually, about her frustration with the media's obsession with talking about brave Paralympic athletes and the things they've overcome, rather than celebrating their achievements as extraordinary athletes, and I do wonder, even as I prepare these questions for you, if it's something you find kind of irritating, that need to keep retelling and reliving the trauma in your life that then defines you in your achievements. I wasn't even sure whether to ask you or talk about it, so it is an interesting dichotomy, isn't it, of telling that story, but actually we just want to celebrate you as an extraordinary individual and athlete.
Stef Reid:I think the line is always going to sit somewhere in the middle. So I'm going to answer your question two ways. So number one, as a sports commentator, I, when I'm commentating, I commentate on both Olympic and Paralympic sports. But here's a question I always have Okay, so if we're looking at a Paralympic race and the winner is going to win the 100 meters in, let's say, 11 seconds, so as an audience member, why would someone in the audience want to watch somebody run 100 meters in 11 seconds when you can watch someone like Usain Bolt run it in 9.6?
Stef Reid:I think it's a legitimate question. But when you understand a little bit about the Paralympics and you understand, okay, so there are physical disabilities that people are overcoming. What does that look like for training? Oh, my goodness, I didn't even know you could still run or do something like that. Or you watch this person walk, and there's been times when you'll see people in the village and you watch them walk and you'll think the last thought on your mind will be that person's definitely an athlete, they're a sprinter. And then you see them on the track and you're like my goodness, like I just was not expecting that. And so I think part of the draw to the Paralympics is actually the story, and understanding that, because that gives that 11 seconds context and I don't think we're going to have a sport unless we give that context. But you're right, it needs a balance.
Stef Reid:So I'm with Tani on the take of brave. If you were going to watch a race and call it brave, is it brave because somebody went out for 1,500 meters? They front run the whole thing, they went for it Okay, that is brave and they risk getting caught, yes, that is brave. But if you are calling that person brave for getting out in front of a stadium, in front of a live TV audience, with a disability and that's the only reason to call them brave, I think that probably says more about the person commentating, in terms of their thoughts and how they might perceive and deal with disability, rather than the actual performance itself.
Sue Anstiss:And you are commentating for the Paralympics, is that correct?
Stef Reid:So, yeah, I've actually got my dream presenting job with CBC. So CBC is the Canadian broadcaster and, yeah, that's actually, it's huge. It's so exciting to kind of make that jump from being a pundit and a commentator to now being a presenter. And it's been, you know, a year in the making. And again, getting that job was actually people ask well, how do you get that job? And it's saying yes. It's saying yes as opportunities.
Stef Reid:I actually got the job because I had just finished a very, very punishing schedule of commentating at the Paris Para-Athletics World Championships and athletics commentating anyone who's done it. It is long hours You're looking at probably 18-hour workdays and barely any sleep. And they asked me to host. It was a media panel the next day. Again, I'd had very little sleep. I almost thought you know what this is going to be terrible. I should just say no, I'm going to be awful, showed up, did the best job that I could. It just so happened that one of the lead producers at CBC was watching and just said you know what? We want her and it's just the most random thing ever. But again, can you imagine what if I had just said no? Do you know what? No, I'm not going to host it Again. Opportunities are the best thing that can ever happen to you. Always take them.
Sue Anstiss:I was going to close in asking you what you'd like to do in the future, but it seems from talking to you, who knows what those opportunities might be. What do you hope that your legacy will be across sport and, more broadly, in the work that you're doing?
Stef Reid:Legacy is such an interesting word. I don't I'm not really that fussed about my legacy as such. I just know that everything that I've been able to do has been the product of people investing in me, and so I would just love to be able to invest in those around me and in the different ways that that looks like I do. I always have a plan actually on my wall at the moment, I've got boards and sheets of things that I want to be doing, but I think it's good to have a plan but also hold it loosely, because sometimes things come up that are way better than anything you could have contrived, and so I've been really enjoying the work that I've been doing with executive coaching and seeing where that goes. I do want to keep moving along in the broadcast world because it is it's, you'll know, you know, with your podcast, when you are given a voice and given an opportunity to present things in a certain light. It's powerful. It then shapes a narrative and shapes how people see things, and I want to be part of that conversation.
Stef Reid:You know, for so long it was like, oh no, I don't want to give my opinion. What if people disagree with it? To now, well, great people should disagree with it, otherwise it clearly wasn't anything worth talking about. And so, just seeing this kind of evolution in me and again, yeah, just trying, I'm in the middle of writing a book. It's taken. I genuinely thought I would finish it in three months. It's been two and a half years and I'm just about at the proposal stage. But I think the world is so big and there's so much to explore and I'm just trying to take those time limits off myself. I've been like, well, you should be here by X number of years, or you should be here Just if something comes up and it's interesting. Take the time to do it properly and do it justice and do it justice.
Sue Anstiss:Thanks so much to Stef for so openly sharing her story. I love her approach to taking on new challenges. Never be afraid to be a beginner is certainly a mantra that resonated with me If you'd like to hear from more trailblazers like Stef. There are over 180 episodes of the Game Changers podcast that are free to listen to on all podcast platforms or on our website at fearlesswomen. co. uk. Para-athletes I've spoken to include Tanni Grey-Thompson, Sarah Story, Lauren Stedman, Ellie Simmons, Claire Taggart, Sophie Carragill, Anne Wafula-Strike and Hannah Cockcroft.
Sue Anstiss:Along with these elite athletes, other guests include coaches, entrepreneurs, broadcasters, scientists, journalists and CEOs all women who are changing the game in sport. As well as listening to all the podcasts on the website, you can also find out more about the Women's Sport Collective, a free, inclusive community for all women working in sport. We now have over seven and a half thousand members across the world, so please do come and join us. The whole of my book Game On the Unstoppable Rise of Women's Sport is also free to listen to on the podcast. Every episode of series 13 is me reading a chapter of the book.
Sue Anstiss:Thank you once again to Sport England for backing the Game Changers through the National Lottery and to Sam Walker at what Goes On Media, who does such an incredible job as our executive producer. Thank you also to my lovely colleague at Fearless Women, kate Hannan. You can find the Game Changers across all podcast platforms and make sure you follow us now so you don't miss out on future episodes. Come and say hello on social media, where you'll find me at sue anstis, the game changers. Fearless women in sport.
