The Game Changers

Andrea Spendolini-Sirieix: On faith, family and finding joy in diving

• Sue Anstiss • Season 16 • Episode 6

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Andrea Spendolini-Sirieix is the diving sensation who won Gold at the Commonwealth Games and European Championships last year and will be one to watch at the Paris Olympics where she’s competing in both the individual and synchronised 10 metre events.

Andrea openly shares her journey in sport and her passion to address stereotypes around aesthetics and body image. We explore the impact of intense training and competition on Andrea’s mental health after Tokyo, how her faith and a change in mindset have had a positive impact on her results. Andrea reflects on the joy she’s now found in the sport and her future ambitions.

Thank you to Sport England who support The Game Changers Podcast with a National Lottery award.

Find out more about The Game Changers podcast here: https://www.fearlesswomen.co.uk/thegamechangers

Hosted by Sue Anstiss
Produced by Sam Walker, What Goes On Media

A Fearless Women production

Sue Anstiss:

Hello and welcome to The Game Changers. I'm Sue Anstiss, and this is the podcast where you'll hear from trailblazing women in sport who are knocking down barriers and challenging the status quo for women and girls everywhere. What can we learn from their journeys as we explore some of the key issues around equality in sport and beyond, I'd like to start with a big thank you to our partners, Sport England, who support The Game Changers through a National Lottery Award. Today, I'm incredibly excited to be joined by a British professional diver who has already won two Commonwealth Golds, two European Golds and a world championship gold, and she's not yet 20.

Sue Anstiss:

Andrea burst onto the scene as a 13 year old, making her international debut, and just two years later she won her first solo gold at the 2020 fina diving grand prix and was also recognized as bbc Young Sports Personality of the Year. Andrea's become a real advocate for addressing some of the stereotypes around aesthetics in sport and body image. She'll be competing at the Paris Olympics this summer and will definitely be one to watch. Andrea, can I take you back to where it all started? So where did you grow up and how much was sport a part of your life as a family?

Andrea Spendolini-Sirieix:

Yeah, of course. Thank you for having me first off. Amazing pronunciation of my name First time where it's like first time round.

Andrea Spendolini-Sirieix:

I've been practicing. I've been practicing Well, it's been paid off? No, so I grew up in Peckham, london, and I've always been involved in sports. Somehow I was a very fidgety kid and I had a lot of energy, so I needed to expel that energy. Somehow. My parents thought it was best through sport. So I did like gymnastics, I did break dancing, I did tennis, I did swimming and then we stumbled into diving because I was talent tested in my school.

Andrea Spendolini-Sirieix:

So Chris Snowed from Crystal Palace came to my primary school and was like can you jump, are you flexible? And obviously, you know, I wanted to like, try hard because, like you know, I wanted to show off my moves and everything. And he was like, oh, you could come and try um diving. And I gave it to my mum and my mum was like another sport, that's brilliant, um. So we went and we we did a tryout, but I wasn't. I was like I'm doing all of these things already, like I don't want to add another sport. And I was like, because my friends weren't going, I didn't want to go. And my mum was like no, we're going. And we got the whole family there and then somehow I got through and they were like, oh yeah, we can try, we can start doing some lessons now. And then again I was like no, I don't want to. And my mum was like come on, you need to. And my dad was like, come on, you just go and go and try. And then I haven't stopped since.

Sue Anstiss:

What was it about diving that you love so? Obviously you dropped other things too, but but what was it that you loved about the driving itself?

Andrea Spendolini-Sirieix:

It's very different to the other ones. Like in gymnastics, I was really scared of the landing, like the fact that if I landed wrong, something could happen. Swimming was also too boring for me, like just swimming back and forth. It's a life skill and I'm glad that I've got it, but to do it like every day day, I wasn't passionate about it and then diving was just so different. It's like I don't really know how to describe it. It's just you have that adrenaline, adrenaline, adrenaline rush, sorry every time that you jump. And then to be able to do those like dives and everything. Sometimes, like even now, I'm like I don't know how my body does that. Um, but no, it was just really exciting and it was something extremely different and it made me very, very, you know, set apart. Like no one really did diving around me. No one knew what it was. I didn't know what it was, so it was very exciting and what was the training like as a young diver?

Sue Anstiss:

how intense is it? Because I think you've mentioned the swimming I know kind of becomes all hours of the day and early mornings and so on. So how intense was the diving training as a young person?

Andrea Spendolini-Sirieix:

so it depends how many days a week you do, but it starts off maybe like two hours once a week and then you can up your days. I did from age maybe nine to just before lockdown. I was doing like five to six sessions a week and I was doing 4, 30 till 8 on the weekdays, then 7 till 12, 2 till 5 on Saturday and then 8 till 12 on Sunday and Monday was off. So it was like full-on, like I'd have my whole day at school which finished at 3 30. I'd go straight to Crystal Palace and then do my training session and then get home around 9, 9, 30 and if I had homework I had to do homework and then I was off to bed.

Andrea Spendolini-Sirieix:

So you know I didn't have any weekends when I was younger and lockdown was a really nice like break. I was like I get to have my weekends, I get to spend time with my family, like I get to focus on work. And now I do Monday, wednesday, friday two sessions. Those are in the morning and the afternoon, and then Tuesday, thursday, saturday, one session and those are kind of like midday.

Sue Anstiss:

And I'm sure for many people the 10-metre high board is quite scary in thought. It's the board that many of us jumped off for a dare at the local swimming pool, myself included. But how quickly did you move up to that 10-metre board? And what is it that you love about diving off a 10-metre board?

Andrea Spendolini-Sirieix:

So, obviously, because it's so high and I was really really small, I couldn't just jump off it straight away, like you have to go up the levels, like you can't just throw yourself off. So what they do is they start you off by like going on poolside, then one metre, three metre, and then you work your way up. You can't start on the 10 meter straight away because it's dangerous, um, so there's some health and safety that you need to go through. But you know, I didn't have a choice, you know it. My, my coach was like your figure is made for 10 meter, and I was like, okay, and she was like so you're going to be a platform diver. She also was a world champion platform diver on the 10 meter. So she knew, she knew yeah, um and no, she was incredible. Her name is ten lin and she was a chinese, chinese athlete and so the chinese technique and the chinese way of training is very intense and having that as a young age like really shaped who I was as a diver, like the foundation of my technique, the foundation of discipline, there was no way that you could give up in that group.

Andrea Spendolini-Sirieix:

But the first time I dove off I can't remember how old? I was, but it took me a long time to jump. I was like I'm not ready for this, it's too high. And it felt like I was in the air for hours because I was so light, I wasn't dropping, I just felt like I was just floating down.

Andrea Spendolini-Sirieix:

But the first time I did my first 10-meter dive, obviously we start with requireds, and requireds are like the simple dives, the front dive, the back dive, the one-and-a-halves, not the dives that I do now. The dives, the the front dive, the back dive, the one and a halfs, not the dives that I do now. The dives that I do now are called optionals, and they're called optionals because you choose them. The requireds in junior events they are mandatory.

Andrea Spendolini-Sirieix:

So you have to do those, um, but you start off with those and I just remember feeling like I just hit like a brick wall. When I entered the wall, I was just, I went in so fast and I came out and I was like, oh my gosh, what has just happened to my body? Um, but it comes with conditioning as well. So you need to do a lot more of those in order to not feel that kind of intense pain. But no, it's really all about progression because you can't do those dives, you can't do the big dives without having done the little dives as well and can you talk us through a dive in competition?

Sue Anstiss:

so firstly, as now, and you're competing at the level, you're competing now. So what are you thinking as you're climbing the stairs up to the wards, the top? What's kind of in your mind as you make that approach?

Andrea Spendolini-Sirieix:

so in competition is very different to in training. Just because the variable of you've got judges, you're really by yourself, like I kind of look at it now as performing, because there are people there to watch and there are people there judging your performance. So I use it as a way. You know, my family, my mum, my dad, say that I'm a show girl, like I really enjoy a show, I really enjoy performing and I always have, and so my faith also plays a really big role and I feel like if I only think about a dive, I actually tend to crumble because I'm putting so much pressure on myself to be like you have to do it this way, you have to do it that way, whereas I know how to do the dive. So in competition it's very important that I remain calm and humble and just, I pray a lot in competition. So I go up the stairs, stop at three meter, I do a drill. I'm still praying. I go up in five meter, do a drill. Just remember, remember, like keeping my focus on God, because when I do that I feel like I'm a more level in my thinking. There's almost like it's just peace, instead of thinking of like okay, the judge is there, my family's there, like there's crowds, like. Instead of thinking about all the other variables, I'm only focused on one thing, and that one thing helps me to recenter myself and to refocus my thinking and my eye line. And also it's important to remember like there's five dives in a competition. So if you're on your first dive and you're already thinking about your second, third, fourth and fifth dive, you're actually disrupting your routine. You need to take it one dive at a time and my coach always goes okay, that dive's done out of your head. Whether it was good or bad doesn't matter. It needs to leave your head because you've got more to do and a competition is never finished until the last dive. And until the last diver, let's say you do a bad dive, it's not over because you still got. You still got more dives to go.

Andrea Spendolini-Sirieix:

Let's take, for example, my first dive.

Andrea Spendolini-Sirieix:

My first dive is a handstand and I'm always very shaky, just the adrenaline, a bit of like excited nerves, and so whenever I'm in my handstand, I'm always like please, god, please, just let me hold this handstand, and I'm just like my legs are like physically shaking on the way up. And then, once I'm up there, you have to hold it for three seconds and then I'm just like, okay, go and I just push and I just do the dive like I would in training, and that kind of starts my competition off like, okay, the first dive's done, I can just warm up into the competition. But no, I really do enjoy competing. I feel like it's um, it gets more fun as the the years go by. I remember when I competing, I feel like it gets more fun as the years go by. I remember when I was younger I was petrified because I was looking at it in the wrong way, whereas now I look at it as an experience and as a way of performing you know and have you always had that faith from a young child?

Sue Anstiss:

Is that kind of with your family? Is that something you've found in the last few years as you've competed so?

Andrea Spendolini-Sirieix:

I became a Christian when I was 12 years old. I've always believed in God and my mum's side of the family are very, very strict believers and I always was like believe in God, but I don't know where to go. And I always found it so beautiful when I would enter a church, and especially the church in my mum's village, and I would feel like at home, just like how beautiful it was and like the dedication to God, and I just felt very like that's where I belonged. You know, as the years have gone by, I've definitely created my own relationship with God where it's not just my mum saying, OK, we're going to church today, it's actually me wanting to go, me wanting to study and pray and it's something that is right at the core of my being. I wouldn't be who I am, I wouldn't be where I am without God and without faith and without that community. No, it's really helped me in tough times and in the good times as well. You know, it's not like the only time I talk to God is when I need help. No, I talk to him every day. And that's really strengthened my identity as well, because I feel like for a long time, when I was far away from God.

Andrea Spendolini-Sirieix:

My identity was in diving, because I feel like for a long time, when I was far away from God, my identity was in diving, and when that failed, I feel like I failed, whereas the closer I am to God, the more I'm like these are bonuses. Diving being a diver is a bonus. Going to the Olympics is a bonus. It doesn't create who you are. It's an addition to who you are, and that has really helped. Going into competitions as well, because'm thinking good or bad, this doesn't define who I am and this doesn't change who I am. And I feel like with every competition, you gain something and if you look at it in that way, it really helps, because you either win a medal or you win a lesson. You know, I feel like sometimes winning a lesson is more valuable than winning a medal, because you want to grow, and I feel like if you're always winning medals, there's like no reason to grow, whereas if you go through peaks and troughs, you have a reason to want to change.

Sue Anstiss:

Yeah, absolutely, I was going to ask you. I was going to ask you. I was going to ask you you've almost answered a bit there as well about how you handle nerves before those big events, especially when it comes down to that final dive. And I was watching some of your dives again in preparation for talking to you and I get really nervous when I'm just watching on the screen. I was still nervous but clearly then your faith and that approach, as you would do with any student working with a psychologist, has helped you in that approach of actually when you're on the board and you're walking out and it is that final dive.

Andrea Spendolini-Sirieix:

I've learned how to compose myself throughout the years, like, definitely at commies, for example, my heart was beating so fast, I could physically feel it in my throat and obviously I get, I get excited. You know, these nerves aren't like, oh my gosh, I'm scared, like oh my gosh, like this is, this is an exciting feeling, to kind of be like, okay, I'm going to close this competition on a on a good note. But I feel like there's two different kinds of nerves. There's nerves that stem from excitement and there's nerves that stem from pressure. And the ones that stem from pressure are usually linked with fear and it's kind of like a fear of disappointment. You know, an excite, like a feeling of excitement to perform, and a feeling of excitement to compete doesn't necessarily mean to do well, but it means, you know, showing, showing joy to being able to compete.

Andrea Spendolini-Sirieix:

And I feel like sometimes, as athletes, we kind of take competitions for granted because, like I do this every day. But it's also like, but you were invited to this event, like you were chosen to go to this country or you were chosen to compete for your country. Like it's things that we shouldn't take for granted, but we do and I've really had to check myself on that a couple of times because I've been like, oh, I'm tired or I'm far away from home, you know all of these things, and I actually have to be like, actually I'm here, like I want, it doesn't really matter what happens, I just need to enjoy the process. And that's what me and my coach have been working on, which is just enjoying, because if I don't enjoy, it doesn't matter if I win or if I don't medal, I would not be happy. I've said this a couple of times, but I don't want to do my last dive and feel relief. I want to feel joy.

Sue Anstiss:

Lovely, that's fabulous to hear. I was just going to take you back if I could do before 2022 to Tokyo, because it was a very different experience, wasn't it? You were just 16. There was no crowds there. So what was that experience? I feel it from the outside. You feel it must have been tough for athletes, but to have such a milestone and not have the crowds and the people around you, what was that like?

Andrea Spendolini-Sirieix:

It, the crowds and the people around you, what, what was that like? It was incredibly difficult. Um, I'd gone through a lot already since, you know, covid. You know, coming back starting training again was absolutely terrible. I hate it, like it was so hard. And then, leading up to Tokyo, I had my um, my GCSEs, and I had to do them at home. I wasn't allowed to go into school, I wasn't allowed to go see my friends, I was only just allowed to see my family and that kind of restriction made it like feel like I was caged and I know everyone was going through this because of COVID times. But you know, so hard like I wasn't able to celebrate with my friends, you know with whom I I had lived my whole diving life with, basically, and this was to ensure that you didn't get any um any infection ahead of the Olympic Games.

Andrea Spendolini-Sirieix:

Yeah, COVID protocols and everything. So I was like totally respect your decision, but I totally respect this. I want to do this myself. I want to go to the games.

Andrea Spendolini-Sirieix:

But I was also so tired mentally and and physically I had struggled a lot in training, I was very inconsistent, I wasn't doing well mentally and so going out there having already been feeling isolated, and going out there and feeling even more isolated you know, my family wasn't there um, it was just so hard to push through and I just felt like I was just floating like the whole time, like I would be at training and it didn't really matter how it was going, like I really didn't care. So I was just diving and just diving for the sake of diving. I didn't really have a goal, I didn't really enjoy it and yeah, looking back, like I was looking at photos and I was just like man, it was such a dark time because it should have been like this is the biggest milestone so far in my career, like I'm 16 and I'm at the Olympic Games, and it just felt like I much rather didn't want to be there because I just wasn't happy, like it wasn't fulfilling either. And you know when some people say, oh, like when I get this, I'll be happy. I thought when I got there, I feel like I completed it and it was like I feel so incomplete. No one was in the crowds. I was like, oh, where's where's the support? And obviously we had like our teammates there, but it's nothing in comparison to having actual people there and they had like a tv without all a speaker that was doing fake noises just to make sure that there was some noise in the arena and I was just thinking to myself this is not how I want my first Olympic Games to to go like.

Andrea Spendolini-Sirieix:

But other than that, I try to end every day with some gratitude, like me and my teammate Scarlett would go out and sit together in the evenings and just look at the skyline and just be like we just were telling each other what we were grateful for that day or and talking to each other it was so nice to have her there and kind of be like that, that older sister that I never had, and those are always the memories that I'll hold on to the most with the Olympics. Not even the competition, not even the training, not even the food that was really good, just just those moments in the evening that I could take with with my friend and just actually feel like it was an Olympic Games, because remember like we had to go around outside wearing masks. Looking back now I just think, oh my gosh, like such crazy times. But no, it was very, very, very different and very difficult. So I'm very excited for Paris because I know it's not going to be anything like that and you've taught.

Sue Anstiss:

You said that earlier. I love that phrase, you know. Talk about the joy and finding the joy in it. So clearly that sounds like, uh, you know it was. As you said, it's a dark time there coming back. So what? What shifts didn't change in terms of your coming back from Tokyo. How were you, you kind of feeling mentally there and where did that change occur to get you I'm going to come on then to 2022, but that kind of timing between your kind of breakthrough year from coming back from the Olympic Games it actually got worse after the.

Andrea Spendolini-Sirieix:

Olympic Games. Um no, it got a lot darker after the Olympics, which is not something nice to say, but it's the truth. I got back and sometimes I struggle with things called mental blocks and I had those out in Tokyo, but those were like I could deal with them and then, when we came back after a break, my mental blocks got really bad what do you mean by mental blocks?

Andrea Spendolini-Sirieix:

sorry, um, like, for example, mentally your brain is telling you you can't do this dive, so physically you don't jump. And for me specifically, my brain was telling me that I was going to do a completely different dive and so I wouldn't physically jump because I was scared that I would do what my brain was telling me and that completely, like it just took over my life when I was at training. I was thinking about training and like that fear, like it really like drained me and I was at school and I was thinking about training and I was at home and I was thinking about training and then my school started to take a hit and then my, my life at home started to take a hit as well, and then my life of training started to take a hit. So everything kind of came crumbling down and in December we were supposed to go to Junior Worlds but due to some circumstances we weren't able to go. And I've never felt such relief from a competition being cancelled and I hate saying that because it was such a great opportunity. But not being able to go allowed me to take a step back and say I'm going to take some time off because I can't jump and I'm too scared to jump. So I took a week off and in that week I was being normal and I was so bored I was like this is not. This is not what I envisioned. This is not what I envisioned, you know, normal life to be like I was. Just there was nothing that was that was making me want to grow and I said something needs to change because, as it is right now, I will quit.

Andrea Spendolini-Sirieix:

So me and my mum made the decision that I would change coach, and this is where I started my relationship with um Alex Rochas, who is my now coach, and I said to Alex, I called him and I said listen, I know right now you're struggling and there's a lot of people on your plate. I'm so sorry, but I will either quit or I will move into your group or whoever is there. I don't care who's there, I just need someone. I need a different atmosphere, I need a change of pace. And he was like. He just welcomed me with open arms and at that time we unfortunately lost a coach and so Alex was juggling 13, 14, 15 people all at once and I really I was like he was like superman. I was like I don't know how you're doing this, but thank you. And he was like, okay, we need to start fresh, like we can't just put you on termita. Like he went through mental blocks as well as a diver, and so it was so nice to be able to relate to someone else because he understood what I was going through, not to the extent of like, oh yeah, like a completely, but he was very understanding and he was like, like, okay, we first need to get you to love this sport again, otherwise you don't want to make changes. And I was like completely agree. And you know, I was just coming into training like there were loads of people, so I just felt like it was a huge community compared to my small group of three before and it just felt like a breath of fresh air and I was just like I am excited to come in the training and it was so nice to to have that joy back again.

Andrea Spendolini-Sirieix:

And then, as time kind of progressed, I just started doing my dives again and it wasn't like I didn't want my dives to be perfect, I was just happy that I was doing them. I was like I'm happy that I'm throwing myself off, like, even though those thoughts still came back every now and then they were a lot easier to deal with because I had joy, whereas before it was like I just let my brain take over because I wasn't happy anyway. So now I was kind of fighting and I kind of missed that. I missed that version of me that was willing to fight. And then I had that back. I was like there was not going to stop me, like I'm just going to keep on pushing and, pushing and pushing, and even with each competition I would do better. You know, I wasn't. I wasn't winning straight away, and I'm glad that I wasn't, because it kept me humble and it kept me wanting, got complacent and I finished 19th, didn't make the semi, uh, distraught. I was like Alex, I love diving. Now why is this happening? Like I'm so upset. And then my physio came over to me and said this is the kick. You need to never feel like this again. And I've never felt like that again.

Andrea Spendolini-Sirieix:

So when it came back after Budapest, I was training, training to win. I wasn't training to just train, I was training to win. And that kind of mental change and that mental switch really just like boom. I just like ignited like a fire inside of me that I never seen before and I was like I'm going for it. So, commies was an incredible, you know, testament of the, the glory of God.

Andrea Spendolini-Sirieix:

And then after that I was so tired. We went to Europeans in Rome like literally three days after and I was like mentally gone, physically gone, emotionally gone, and I was just like it was the first time I'd been in Italy in three years. So the fact that I was in Italy, I was like I don't care what happens here, I'm happy. And it turned out to be amazing again. All of that stemmed from joy and all of that stemmed from loving my sport and actually wanting to grow, because before I was okay with being stagnant, I was okay with not doing very good, like I was doing, okay and that was enough for me. And now it's kind of like I want to keep on pushing boundaries. I want to keep on pushing and, pushing, and pushing and see what I can achieve, because they're all bonuses in my life. They don't make me who I am, they're just an addition to who I am, and I feel like that kind of change really does help with all of the competitions.

Sue Anstiss:

What's the name of your physio to give them a shout out? Who kind of said that whole Gareth? Okay, I love that.

Andrea Spendolini-Sirieix:

Gareth is just honestly, he's got a load of wisdom. He's got so much wisdom, Like when we do physio and like trips and stuff. We always have nice conversations but he really was like it's the kick that you need. And I was like it's the kick that you need and I was like it absolutely is. And I went to see my parents after the competition as well and I was just crying. They looked at me and they said like listen, you know you're never going to feel like this again because I know, like my mum always tells me, she knew when that competition didn't go well that the rest was going to be amazing yeah, that's so good, so true.

Sue Anstiss:

um, you mentioned going out for the Europeans in Rome, and obviously your mum's Italian, so that must have felt like a second home games, almost having been at the Commonwealth Games as well too.

Andrea Spendolini-Sirieix:

It was so nice, but I never had like a home games before and then going from commies then going to Rome, I was like this is the best year ever.

Sue Anstiss:

It's interesting at Rome, it's the outside pool, which was really beautiful to watch as a spectator. But how different is it for you competing as an?

Andrea Spendolini-Sirieix:

athlete so strange. Um, the sun was just like in your eyes. I I've never dove outside on 10 meter before and I was like I'll be honest, I didn't have the mental strength to kind of like adjust, so I was just throwing myself off. Honest, I didn't have the mental strength to kind of like adjust, so I was just throwing myself off and hoping for the best. You know, hoping and praying, um, but looking back now like I don't, it was okay. Would I do it again, like if I had the choice? No, but you know, I got a bit of a tan, got very, and I was in Italy, so I had ice cream every day and pasta every day. I was happy. And you got a gold medal. Yeah, I got two gold medals, so even happier.

Sue Anstiss:

So you got gold in the Commonwealth Games, then two golds at Europeans and then early this year you became the first British woman to win an individual world championship medal in an Olympic event when you won bronze in the 10 metre in Doha. So I know that you also went on to win bronze in the synchronised event with Lowest Austin and then a gold with the mixed diving event alongside Tom Daly. So clearly I think it's really interesting to hear that story as to the shift that you saw then in those world championships from where you had been before. Did it feel very different in Do been before? Did it feel very different in Doha? Did you feel very different as an athlete?

Andrea Spendolini-Sirieix:

well, yeah, definitely like. Budapest was my first world champs and I didn't make a semi-final. Fukuoka in 2023 was my second world champs and I didn't make the final. And then, going into Doha, I was like I just want to make a final and I was very nervous in my semi-final, like my prelim, the like my, my thought process, my, just my routine. Everything was so spot on. And then it got to the semi-final and I was like, oh, I'm pretty nervous, I'm pretty shy. And then Alex could see that I was in my head when I when he sees that he talks to me more and he gets me out of my you know the stress that I was in. And then my final I was like I feel like I've completed the goal. Whatever comes from, this final is an addition.

Andrea Spendolini-Sirieix:

The North Korean girl was really on my case and I was just like I enjoy this, I enjoy fighting because at the end it feels more, more like I earned it, you know, and I really, really liked that. She put some pressure on me. And then I put pressure on her and then she fumbled a little bit and then I was like I just want to just do a good back twist and I was a little bit nervous, just because I was like she's quite good at the twist as well. And then I saw a personal best like you can see the scoring and I saw that I got an international, international personal best and I was just so happy, like whether I got the medal or not, I was just happy that I got a personal best and no, it was. Um, it was incredible, my dad was there and no, it was so nice. Alex cried as well and I was just like, oh, it was, it was, it was so, it was so good. It just felt very rewarding.

Sue Anstiss:

I was gonna ask you about the preparation for synchro events, if I can, because I guess from the outside, as an outsider, but it does feel like it must be so much tougher than training for individual dives. So how do you manage to get so completely synchronized? Can you just briefly talk through?

Andrea Spendolini-Sirieix:

but the process of learning a new drive with somebody else, yeah well, synchro is actually very, very interesting, where it's like usually you get two people who are quite comfortable in the individual events and then you just like do a little bit of changes, and they usually put two people who are quite similar together.

Andrea Spendolini-Sirieix:

So it's never like you have to make like a drastic change, like that never happens. So me and lois were put together in rome and they were like we don't have anyone in this event, you want to try it? And we were like okay, and then we just did some gym stuff, did a couple adjustments, and then from there we were like, oh, this is quite good, should we, should we do some more? And they were like, yeah, okay. And then we're like okay, and we just went from there like we find the time to train and we find the time to, you know, do some stuff together, but in reality it's quite simple. You just need to make sure that. But in reality it's quite simple. You just need to make sure that you get in the water at the same time.

Sue Anstiss:

I love the way you make it sound so easy. I'm going to move a little bit to, I guess, that whole piece of education. I've had three daughters at home going through the stress of A-level so I kind of know what that is like dealing with that. And I am fascinated to know you've obviously balanced the mental demands of studying with the mental demands of your sport too. You've kind of finished now, so you're part of that, so it's all swimming at the moment. Where are you in terms of education and uni? What are your thoughts there?

Andrea Spendolini-Sirieix:

I finished my A-levels last year, then I took a gap year this year, so I'm just doing diving, but I'm going to uni in September for journalism at City University of London oh brilliant, yeah. So I'm really excited to start that, oh fabulous.

Sue Anstiss:

Well, let's have a conversation away from here. We can have another conversation about that. And if you weren't doing enough with your A-levels, you also did an EPQ looking at aesthetic sports. So why did you do that? What interested you in that area?

Andrea Spendolini-Sirieix:

It just popped in my head, this question of do aesthetic sports negatively impact sportswomen? You know, attitude towards food and body image, and I was like, oh, I could write a lot about this. And when I first started it was like it came to me so naturally. The words were just flowing on the page and I was like, ok, so I'm going to talk to a psychologist, I'm going to talk to nutritionists, and then I'm going to look at pieces online and you know, see if there's any correlation to all of them. And I suffered with it myself. So I already knew that, yes, they do negatively impact, but for child protection reasons, I couldn't put in my own testimony and I was completely fine with that because I had a lot more information that I could put in. I didn't just need to put in my own story. But no, I feel like that's something that I know a lot of girls have struggled with and I know that in our sport specifically, it's something that is very difficult to deal with because we're in costumes, you know we're judged.

Andrea Spendolini-Sirieix:

Diving is an aesthetic sport. You're judged on how you look in the air. You know your toes, your leg line, the way you enter in the water, and so you know, even with girls, when we go through our periods, you know we're still diving in the water. And so you know, even with girls, when we go through our periods, you know we're still diving in the water. Like we don't have that choice of whether we can or can't compete. You have to compete. With training, it's different, but with competition it's. This is a competition, you can't opt out of it. But no, it was something that I knew was there. I just didn't have the evidence to prove it.

Sue Anstiss:

And have you done more with that now? So are there more conversations happening within the sport? Do you think it's kind of not necessarily just your EPQ having a positive impact, but do you feel that more conversations are being had? I feel I see it across other sports, but what's it like in diving in terms of kind of attitude and body confidence and restriction of diet, etc. Around aesthetics?

Andrea Spendolini-Sirieix:

so I feel like there definitely is more of a movement towards education, which is very important and, you know, even though it's quite a painful light to shed, you know it's very important that it's spoken about and I definitely, you know, I don't shy away from the conversation. So if it's brought up, I'm like, yeah, let's talk about it. But I feel like it's definitely about and I definitely, you know, I don't shy away from the conversation so if it's brought up, I'm like, yeah, let's talk about it, but I feel like it's definitely, you know, the education in young girls is definitely increased. Obviously, there's a lot more that we can do, but in regards to period as well, like a lot more women are speaking out, which is really good, because then, you know, if one person speaks, speaks out, another one does and another one does, and it's kind of this snowball effect of positive change, where it's kind of we're moving away from feeling embarrassed and feeling unsettled about talking about it and it's more widely accepted, which is what we need, you know, because if we don't talk about it, then nothing's going to happen. But no, I'm definitely an advocate for opening conversations.

Andrea Spendolini-Sirieix:

Boys struggle with it too, and that was something that I didn't know, because I'm not a boy, I'm a girl, so I'm only looking at the girl side.

Andrea Spendolini-Sirieix:

But I really do want to look into the male perspective, because I'm sure that there is one, because everyone goes through it in at a certain point in their life and I know that sometimes now I still struggle with it and only now am I comfortable enough to talk about it. And I know that as a younger person I was like I'm gonna get judged if I say this, or I'm someone's gonna say like a bad comment, and it's very, very important that we stray away from that judgment on other people and what they're struggling with is disgusting and I feel like if someone brings something to you especially if it's got to do with their mental well-being or their, you know what they feel about themselves that you treat them with love, because otherwise they won't come to you again, and driving that forwards is just going to make a huge difference it's great, isn't it, that we've witnessed in more open conversations in gymnastics, especially in recent years, with female athletes calling out the overly high cut, revealing leotards and some even choosing to compete in unitards.

Sue Anstiss:

So what's the situation there for female divers? And actually, as you've there, it's not just female divers, is it? It's like the men's diving outfits aren't huge either, are they. So I just wonder, as an elite athlete, do you feel you're able to call things out, or is it really hard to take a stand in a sport that's so much about selection and judges' scores and so on? You know, I kind of feel for the athletes often.

Andrea Spendolini-Sirieix:

I feel like with diving is different than gymnastics.

Andrea Spendolini-Sirieix:

I personally wouldn't want to dive in a wetsuit and, for example, um, but like with the, the outfits themselves, I don't necessarily see a way that we can.

Andrea Spendolini-Sirieix:

You know, maybe obviously there's ways that we can make it so that less of our body is shown, but at the same time, the change that needs to happen is from the people making comments about it. It's almost like we're blaming the athletes for the comments that are coming their way, and I feel like that is absolutely terrible. You know, I haven't asked for anyone to comment on my body. I haven't asked for you to tell me what you think about what I'm wearing. I don't comment on what you're wearing, so what gives you the reason and the power and the righteousness to judge me? And I feel like we will never make real change unless this is called out, because you know we can change everything. We can put unitards on, but there will still be someone that will comment. So I feel like we need to move away from blaming athletes for the way they wear their outfits, because this is our work wear as well, and in terms of that and those comments, how much does social media play a part in your everyday life now as an elite athlete?

Sue Anstiss:

Do you use it to engage with fans? Do you use it to engage with fans?

Andrea Spendolini-Sirieix:

Not really. I don't really message people or reply to comments or reply to DMs. I never did that before. I did read them more and that's why it affected me, because I've read things that people have said to me. But nowadays, let's say, a mum has texted me to ask advice for her daughter that's in diving, or a younger diver is asking for encouragement or just commenting on something, then those things I do really want to, you know, be that kind of big sister that I had and that that I want to be for other people because I want them to feel like I'm approachable.

Andrea Spendolini-Sirieix:

You know, I've gone through so much like I don't want what I've gone through to go to waste. I don't want the struggles, the pain, the tears to go to waste and I want to help people that possibly are going through the same things. But nowadays I just use it for my own enjoyment, not for followers, not for people like I. Just want to create a platform and and a portfolio for brands that I'm proud of. Not that anyone has pushed on me, because, you know, no one can take who you are, because then you're just going to be the second best version of who they want you to be, rather than the best version of of yourself and we're obviously moving closer to the start of the Paris Olympics.

Sue Anstiss:

Now You've already qualified in the 10-metre synchro with Lois Toulson, so congratulations there. It's super exciting. But how are you feeling as the Games approach? And I don't know, do you talk openly about medal hopes? What is your kind of approach there?

Andrea Spendolini-Sirieix:

Obviously, you know, every athlete goes to the Olympic Games with the hopes of meddling. But I'm really going there just to compete and enjoy these games compared to what I couldn't enjoy in Tokyo. And whatever comes from it comes from it. I'm not going to be sad or that beat myself up. I'm going to use it as motivation. But I'm also not going to be like, okay, I'm complete now if I do, if I do get a medal, but I'm not going use it as motivation. But I'm also not going to be like, okay, I'm complete now if I do get a medal. But I'm not going there with like a definite I want this, I want that. I'm going there with an open mind. I'm going there to enjoy myself. I'm going there to really just put on a show Fabulous.

Sue Anstiss:

And you're still waiting to hear whether you qualify for the 10-meter event as well too. So what would that be like to compete at both of those events in Paris? It would be amazing.

Andrea Spendolini-Sirieix:

I mean, I'm so happy that my family can actually come, so again, I'll treat it like in St Croix, and you know we've got our nationals this week, so I'm just going to enjoy nationals as well.

Sue Anstiss:

And whatever comes from it comes from it Again, again. You know it's a competition at the end of the day and I am absolutely thrilled to have you as a guest on the game changes and I realize how busy your schedule is. So I do wonder how do you manage your time for media and sponsors when you're juggling, training and competing and still make a time for life and family and friends? You know what is your, your kind of management of that schedule like well this time around I don't have school, so that really does help, yeah, um.

Andrea Spendolini-Sirieix:

But again, you know my agent Hugo and Jake are incredible, you know. They. They really do help to find time and Alex is also very helpful. Training is I don't want to make training my life, so let let's say I miss a session. It's not like the world's going to crumble and I just I really want to create personal relationships with, with partners and brands, because I want it to feel like I want to do it, not that I feel like, you know, just because I'm contractually obliged I have to do it. And you know, with Adidas, toyota, eurostar, to work with them has been so fun and I've really enjoyed the process and you know, leading up to the games and everything, and it's just been. I've been proud of those partnerships and I've been proud to represent them and to do documentaries of them and things like that. It's just been an incredible, an incredible journey thus far and I feel so blessed, like I didn't think I'd I'd ever get partnerships like this, but to be able to actually get them and and represent them, it's so good.

Sue Anstiss:

I wonder just in closing, finally, if you were talking with your younger self or a young woman starting out in elite sport and I'm sure you ask this a lot but what kind of advice do you share? What advice would you share to someone starting out the?

Andrea Spendolini-Sirieix:

invisible boundaries that are placed don't actually exist. And, you know, don't feel closed off by the opinions of other people because, first off, they're not living your life and, second off, they don't actually know know, no one knows what the future can hold. So why not give it your all, why not work hard and believe that you can do it and then actually push yourself to to break boundaries and to make history, not just for yourself and not just so that you can take all the glory and say I've done it all, but actually to further you know, and to further encourage other people and to further help women's sport, and not just women's sport, but your community, you know, your friends, your family. Because I feel like with every struggle is an opportunity to help someone else struggling. Nothing is ever done in vain, like your pain, your past, your whatever you've gone through is never done in vain. There's always someone that needs help.

Andrea Spendolini-Sirieix:

So I feel like, don't live your life selfishly, don't live your life only thinking of yourself. Actually take the time to help other people around you, to to encourage someone else, because at the same time, you also find ways to encourage yourself. Because if you're telling this person to do this, there's no way that you can't do it yourself as well. I would really encourage them to try something new and be kind to yourself. You know you've only got one body, one mind. Really, really cherish them and take care of yourself goodness me, what an extraordinary young woman.

Sue Anstiss:

I can't wait to see her compete in paris this summer. If you enjoyed the podcast, there are over 180 episodes featuring conversations with women's sport trailblazers and they're all free to listen to on all podcast platforms or at our website, fearlesswomencouk. Along with Olympic and Paralympic athletes like Andrea, I've also spoken to broadcasters, officials and coaches, agents, ceos and journalists. As well as listening to all the podcasts on the website, you can also find out more about the Women's Sport Collective a free, inclusive community for all women working in sport. The whole of my book Game On the Unstoppable Rise of Women's Sport is also free to listen to on the podcast.

Sue Anstiss:

Every episode of Series 13 is me reading a chapter of the book. Every episode of Series 13 is me reading a chapter of the book. Thanks again to Sport England for backing the Game Changers through a National Lottery Award, and to Sam Walker at what Goes On Media, who does such an incredible job as our executive producer. Thank you also to my brilliant colleague at Fearless Women, kate Hannan. You can find the Game Changers wherever you listen to your podcasts and please follow us so you don't miss out on future episodes. Come and say hello on social media, where you'll find me on LinkedIn and Instagram at Sue Anstis the Game Changers Fearless women in sport.

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Sue Anstiss

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