The Game Changers

Katarina Johnson-Thompson: When your role model becomes your biggest rival

August 22, 2023 Sue Anstiss Season 14
The Game Changers
Katarina Johnson-Thompson: When your role model becomes your biggest rival
Show Notes Transcript

To celebrate Katarina Johnson-Thompson’s incredible Heptathlon Gold Medal at the World Championships this weekend, we’re re-releasing this special episode of The Game Changers.

Now a two-time World Champion, Katarina Johnson-Thompson (KJT) has overcome many challenges during her extraordinary impressive athletics career which includes appearances at three Olympic Games. We’re so excited to see her compete again in Paris 2024.  

In this episode, Katarina talks about tackling anxiety and body issues, transforming her mental approach to the sport, learning to handle the pressure after lsoing the love of the sport and how she handled the internal conflict when her childhood role model, Jessica Ennis-Hill, became her biggest rival. 

Katarina also discusses the complicated preparations for the postponed Tokyo Olympics and being an ambassador of the Game On initiative, launched with Liverpool Football Club and Nike to help youngsters access sport in their local area.

Thank you to Sport England who support The Game Changers Podcast through a National Lottery award.

Thank you to Sport England who support The Game Changers Podcast with a National Lottery award.

Find out more about The Game Changers podcast here:

Hosted by Sue Anstiss
Produced by Sam Walker, What Goes On Media

A Fearless Women production

Katarina Johnson-Thompson: When your role model becomes your biggest rival

Sue Anstiss (6s):
Hello, and welcome to The Game Changers; the podcast where you'll hear from extraordinary trailblazing women in sport. I'm your host, Sue Anstiss, and I am thrilled to welcome you to this special bonus episode of The Game Changers, where I talk to a world champion heptathlete Katarina Johnson-Thompson.

Barclays (27s):
Before I introduce you to this global sporting superstar, I'd like to thank Barclays for their ongoing support of The Game Changers podcast. There are few brands across the world who are doing more for women's sport right now. Barclays are the [inaudible] sponsor of the Women's Super League. And they also back the FA in their fantastic work it does, to ensure that every school girl across the country will have a chance to play football, by 2024.

Sue Anstiss (54s):
My guest today played a bit of football herself growing up, but soon turned her attention to track and field, where she's had incredible success. Having almost quit after [inaudible] after disappointment at the Rio Olympics, in 2016, Kat changed much in her life to go on, to become World Champion, in 2019, breaking the British record in the process. It's wonderful to hear how Kat is now fully focused on the games, in Japan, later this month. She's also taking time to support the great work of Liverpool Football Club Foundation, and Nike, as they launch "Game On" a campaign, that's helping youngsters from marginalized communities access more sporting and coaching opportunities.

Sue Anstiss (1m 41s):
I began by asking Kat to take us back to that night, in Doha, in 2019, when she became world champion. How does she feel going into the final event?

Katarina Johnson-Thompson (1m 53s):
Yeah. Going into the final event, it's always a bit of [inaudible], you know, the scenarios at that point, that's the time you can get contacted. So that's your time, you know, like how many seconds you need to beat this person by, how big a gap you need to be. And then you've got your race plans in order to get that time. But also you're thinking, right, this is the end. This is like literally the final push. This is what all those hard Wednesday [inaudible] sessions every time I kill myself for about. And you just want to get it over with. And I think the [inaudible] in particular was epic in the sense that they had to like show up beforehand. So I'd been watching all of these different finals that were going on.

Katarina Johnson-Thompson (2m 33s):
I didn't know whether they had [inaudible], we're going to get one. And then it happened. And it was, cause we get weaker. It's like, maybe, like three heats before, and also the final heat. And it's the top eight, I think, who get to race in the final heat. And, you know, we had the night show, where it just built the tension so much, whereas like the track lines like turned into like they turned to into like...

Sue Anstiss (2m 55s):
A heartbeat.

Katarina Johnson-Thompson (2m 57s):
It was absolutely insane at that point though. It's like, if you want to make me any more, nervous, you've done a really good job. And I think, yeah, just get it finished. That's what I was thinking. Just get over the line and then you can be happy after.

Sue Anstiss (3m 12s):
I rewatched the race this weekend, actually. And I'd forgotten about the night show. I did think, oh, you know, the nerves, you must have felt, just, almost being on a track and that darkness as well, before it started. At what point did you realize that you'd broken Jess's record when you finished?

Katarina Johnson-Thompson (3m 27s):
Not until it came up on the scoreboard and I, you know, I knew that I'd gotten close in terms of the seconds and on the seconds on either, there was 7,000 points, but you know, at that point it was very fine margins and, you know, [inaudible] I'd like to opt to my iPhone. I was trying to squint at the school board and, you know, so that, you know, it was a new [inaudible] and it was just, I'm over Jess's score, which is, you know, a score that has inspired me my whole career. You know, that's one of the first competitions I was in, at 19 years old, at the London 2012 Olympics. And I was there to bear witness to that British record. And I knew how epic it was.

Katarina Johnson-Thompson (4m 8s):
So to surpass that was just a dream come true.

Sue Anstiss (4m 11s):
And how much did your life change after that? What was it like to deal with so much media attention as you won?

Katarina Johnson-Thompson (4m 19s):
I didn't feel like it changed that much, to be honest. I feel like in a sense that 2012, you know, I've been, I had, you know, I was on the cusp of winning and I had that attention, but it wasn't always very positive attention. It was always attention, but normally it was attention on failing at a stage or getting injured. So I don't feel like it changed that much, except people were a little bit nicer about my performance, but yeah, it was just, it changed in the sense that I was relieved, that I finally got to show people that, you know, what I'm about and what I'm capable of. And yeah, that changed me as a person for sure.

Sue Anstiss (4m 54s):
And taking you back, you mentioned that there, but winning in such style, must have laid to bed, clearly, so many demons that you'd had. So looking back, can you just take us back to that period between, you mentioned 2012 and being just 19 and what that experience was like then in terms of moving towards 2016?

Katarina Johnson-Thompson (5m 13s):
Yeah, it was a lot, you know. I was 19 years old at the time and it was my first senior international. It was the home Olympic games. So I had achieved, not many people get the privilege to compete then. And that was everything to me, it was my first exposure to what being an athlete is about. And that's, you know, a couple of weeks after that, you know, I left university in order to pursue my dream to get this, you know, Olympic medal. And I dedicated the next couple of years of my life to, for Rio, you know, a lot of people put that sort of label on me that, you know, you're the next person, you're the next person to do this. And at 23, going into Rio Olympics, everything could change now.

Katarina Johnson-Thompson (5m 56s):
I was very low in confidence, being through a number of different, serious injuries, a number of big defeats and a number of times where I, you know, couldn't handle the pressure almost. So I think that in between those years it was, I did lose the love for the sport a little bit. Yeah. But that was a very tough time for me in order to break through that and come out the other side and compete just for the love of sport, was a very long, hard road.

Sue Anstiss (6m 24s):
And we talk a lot, don't we, about the importance of role models, but it must've been so tough for you to be constantly compared to Jess and to Denise Lewis, to Maya, another lovely hero of the past, but that all that talk of you being that natural successor, I'd say, especially as you say ahead of Rio, in 2016, did you ever consider it wasn't for you? That that kind of pathway that you consider giving up at any point?

Katarina Johnson-Thompson (6m 48s):
Yeah, no, that was, it's true, what you say, you know, Jess was my role model going into 2012 and then, you know, your role model became my biggest struggle in order to try and achieve my dreams. And that's a lot to try and, you know, juggle at such a young age and, you know, I've been lucky to have Denise as a, you know, a sounding board throughout my whole career. She's been such a, you know, rock to me and she helped me get through that the hard phase after the Rio Olympics. And yeah, it was after the Rio Olympics, I just sort of, I didn't want anything to do with the heptathlon again. My high jump is going quite well. And, you know, I broke the British record in the high jump in Rio. And I just thought maybe that that's the events I started with as well.

Katarina Johnson-Thompson (7m 28s):
And I just maybe thought that the heptathlon wasn't for me, but I'm so happy that I still stuck to my gun and stuck with it in the end.

Sue Anstiss (7m 37s):
What do you think it was that kept you going? Is there any advice you'd share with other athletes that might be going through kind of similar struggles from that time?

Katarina Johnson-Thompson (7m 45s):
I was a bit stubborn in a sense that, you know, I knew I hadn't finished business there. I knew that I would live with regret and that's one of the biggest things that I don't want in my career. That's still something I sort of go in through each competition with now, the sense of if I'm going to regret, not try my absolute all in this and I don't want to retire and think, oh, it could have been this, it could have been that instead of I tried and I failed, then I think that's the mindset that I am. I just want to try everything. And if I fail, I fail. But at least I've, you know, tried my absolute best. And that's why I did the heptathlon. It's like one of those things, I didn't want to be made to championships and being in the high jump plane, watching the heptathlon go around and I'm just like, oh, I wish I was involved in it.

Katarina Johnson-Thompson (8m 30s):
I just didn't want that feeling. So, you know, I just stuck to it. And in the end I just started doing heptathlon and the high jump and the heptathlon and the long jump and the champs still.

Sue Anstiss (8m 40s):
And I love that, you know, it's lovely to hear of Denise's support at that time, but what was that catalyst that caused that change? Cause obviously you did have a bit, quite a big shift in terms of loss within your life and your athletics, after 2016. So, can you tell us?

Katarina Johnson-Thompson (8m 56s):
Yeah. It was just, it was literally just like, I didn't know what was going wrong. I didn't know. I knew I had the talent. I knew I was capable of winning these medals, but I didn't know what exactly was breaking down. So I just tore up my health, my whole entire life and started again. I didn't know what was right and what was wrong. So I just thought I'd just get rid of all of it. Yeah. And then I moved to France, post-Rio. So I left my house, left my family and my two little dogs with my mom and yeah, I moved here, to France and haven't looked back since.

Sue Anstiss (9m 29s):
Must've been tough to leave family and home and kind of all that you knew there. And I know, I've heard you talk in the past in terms of your new coach, but how has he helped you transform your mental approach to the sport, as well as your incredible fitness and your skillset clearly? How important has that been for you?

Katarina Johnson-Thompson (9m 47s):
I think he's just very like a chilled out person. I think our personalities match really well. I think he's a very good person to have on your side, come championships. Cause he's just very, like, just relaxed. And like, if something, if you like do a foul or a failure, and if you get something wrong where I would normally go into panic mode, he would just be like, oh, this was good. And that was good. What you need to work on is this instead of always thinking in these [inaudible] and I think know he's very good to have on your side in competition, but also training and just suits what I do, train a little and often. So I train the most, maybe eight times a week, one rest day, and it's very little and it's very often, but you know, it all adds up and it made my body adapt to the heptathlon more, because obviously you have to keep going over to these that calm the competition.

Katarina Johnson-Thompson (10m 43s):
So I think my body just, I feel like I'm a heptathlete now instead of a jumper who's good at running and by the throwing, I feel like I'm an all around athlete now.

Sue Anstiss (10m 52s):
Is that different, that level of intensity or less intense to almost from what you were doing previously, in terms of your training?

Katarina Johnson-Thompson (10m 59s):
It's different in a way where, you know, you're always tired, but sometimes, you know, you go to the track with a different focus. I used to be on some illusion that, if I'm not crawling away from the track every single day, and I've not killed myself and put my body through pain, then I'm not training. Whereas now I just have different focuses and we do do have sessions like that, you know, on Wednesdays and sometimes on Saturdays, but it's not the main focus of every session.

Sue Anstiss (11m 25s):
That's good, that's a positive message to people. And how much of a blow was it for you when you discovered, you know, Tokyo, as we all did, was to be postponed in 2020? Especially as you were in such incredible form, coming off the back of the World Championships, too.

Katarina Johnson-Thompson (11m 41s):
Yeah. It was a tough blow for me to take and for all athletes as well. I think that the time that it got announced, we were, you know, semi-expecting it. But you know, when the things started to unravel and we were in that sort of limbo, where we were still training, but having to shelter and facilities were getting shut down and then we have to adapt and, you know, the timeline was the same but the circumstances were different. That was the heart, despair, I think about her, but once it got canceled, it was just sort of reset and refocused that an [inaudible] like all athletes do; they adapt and you know, the timeline now has changed. Everyone's got an extra year. Some people have used that very well. Some people haven't, you know.

Katarina Johnson-Thompson (12m 21s):
Some people are happy that, you know, there's been an extra year and they're maybe coming back from pregnancies. So I just think that it's just going to be a very, very interesting games. You know, a lot of people are going to win, who wouldn't have won, [inaudible].

Sue Anstiss (12m 37s):
Yeah. Yeah. That's really interesting, isn't it? To think of that difference in that year. And of course we're now just 60 days or so away from games. How are you feeling about that now? Where's your head and your body as it were?

Katarina Johnson-Thompson (12m 50s):
Yeah. It's just going to be one of those things now, we've been waiting for, for so long now, like that, like it's been five years and so much has happened in the last year. Nevermind, the last four years of my life. And everything I've built in the last four years has been leading into these games. So I'm just astounded that it's only, maybe just under two months away. And I think I just, week by week, I'm just trying to get myself in the best shape I can. And I'm just excited when it will finally be there, just see what's going to happen. Cause I can't take this suspense anymore.

Sue Anstiss (13m 30s):
That's so true. And you obviously, you're very proud Liverpudlian. Can you tell me a little bit about kind of life growing up and how much sport played a part of your life as a youngster?

Katarina Johnson-Thompson (13m 41s):
Yeah, sport was everything to me. My mom wanted me to be a dancer, when I was younger and I've always had like a hobby. So she always instilled the fact that I needed the hobby in my life. And I danced before I did sport, for quite some time, but I think, you know, being active and outside and playing and doing different types of activities was always ingrained in me. And I was always out on the street and never home. And yeah, I did a number of different hobbies. I played football. I did dancing and I found athletics and you know, it's been my whole life. So I'm glad that I've been able to make a career out of something that I love.

Sue Anstiss (14m 18s):
And what sort of sacrifices did your family have to make in terms of athletics? My brother actually was an international decathlete many, many years ago. But just knowing in terms of the training and the traveling to events and so on to, for your family's support, must've been so important growing up.

Katarina Johnson-Thompson (14m 36s):
Yeah, I don't ever think my mom would describe it as a sacrifice, I think. She absolutely loved, you know, taking me to these competitions. Like even to this day, she's only missed a handful of competitions. She's always been, you know, a major rock in my career. And once I found something that I loved, you know, she was, it was all eggs in one basket and we, you know, full steam ahead. Like we had a difficult time, you know, sometimes trying to, because I did so many events, you know, there's so many different pairs of spikes, so many kicks and, you know, she didn't drive as well. So it was definitely like long rides in the National Express, like different sources, many competitions in Stockholm, Burmingham and [inaudible]. So yeah, it was very tough, but I think at the time, you know, we would just start an adventure.

Katarina Johnson-Thompson (15m 21s):
We didn't think about the journey. We were thinking about the competition. And I think the main thing she probably would say is when I didn't do well, the journey back was horrendous and I'd be so upset. I wouldn't say two words to her.

Sue Anstiss (15m 37s):
And how important has she been as a strong female role model in your life, too?

Katarina Johnson-Thompson (15m 43s):
Yeah, she is the strongest woman, you know, I know. And you know, she's been such an example to me and she's like the most caring person ever. So she's had such an important role in my upbringing.

Sue Anstiss (15m 55s):
Yeah. And tough for her, or I guess that time when you were struggling in terms of post-2016, as a mother, to kind of witness that, but great that she was there, I assume, in Doha, when you run to see the other side of it.

Katarina Johnson-Thompson (16m 9s):
Yeah. No, for sure. And I always say to her, I always like sort of advocate that performance, because during those tough times, she always knew that I was capable of that. So I always say that that performance was prove that she was right all along.

Sue Anstiss (16m 23s):
That was lovely. And I imagine, this is kind of one of the many reasons that you're so passionate about the new Game On initiative, today, that's being launched with Nike and Liverpool Football Club, too. It's really ambitious project. So can you tell us a little bit more about it?

Katarina Johnson-Thompson (16m 40s):
Yeah. It's obviously something that I'm very passionate about. You know, it's two things very close to my heart, you know, my Liverpool FC, my club and, you know, [inaudible] sponsored Nike, they've seemed off to launch Game On, which is programmed to help local youngsters from, you know, 7 to 12, across Liverpool City region and in a range of different sports from a marginalized community. So that is something that I'm very passionate about and very proud to be an ambassador of.

Sue Anstiss (17m 8s):
And this is a partnership, obviously, as you say, it's with Nike and also with Liverpool Football Club and you're already an ambassador for the Liverpool Football Club Foundation. So what part did the club play in your life growing up?

Katarina Johnson-Thompson (17m 21s):
Yeah, the club played like a huge part of my life. Like growing up, my granddad was a huge Liverpool fan and just in my house, I used to live across the row from my nana and granddad when I was younger. And you know, every weekend we used to just watch the football and that was a way that we bonded, in a way that, you know, I found my passion of sports and eventually gave up dancing because of that. But, you know, Liverpool have been, you know, a huge inspiration to my career as well, you know, that never give up attitude and each season, like they just never stop inspiring me. So that's, you know, it's absolutely over the moon to be in a partner and with the LFC foundation, for sure, on this course, especially.

Sue Anstiss (18m 4s):
What do you think is so unique about Liverpool and that strength of community that we, for the people that aren't from the area, I guess, we just see that from the outside, but how would you describe that?

Katarina Johnson-Thompson (18m 15s):
I don't know how to describe it. I think it's in the anthem, for a start; you'll never walk alone. It it's part of our DNA and it's part of our beliefs. And I think that I've felt the support from not even LFC, but Liverpool City region as a whole, you know, every time that I come back, I just feel like the whole city's routing for me, you know, they have this like belief all the time and beyond the [inaudible] and I just absolutely love it.

Sue Anstiss (18m 45s):
That's fabulous to hear. The love is there. And, as you mentioned, you also support young people in your community through your own foundation. So can you tell me a little bit more about the KJT Academy and why you set that up?

Katarina Johnson-Thompson (18m 57s):
Yeah, it was similar. We set the KJT Academy up last summer. It was something that, you know, I really wanted on reflection, in the pandemic, when I was just sitting around doing nothing. You know, it made me reflect on my life and you know, what I wanted to do and why, who I wanted to be as an athlete. And, you know, we set that up with the LFC foundation last year and that's for an age group, which is a little bit older, than the Game On. And, you know, it's for that sort of similar, you know, Black and Asian community, the marginalized community and in that sort of dropout region where, you know, you don't have the financial support.

Katarina Johnson-Thompson (19m 38s):
You don't really have the means to, you know, juggle schoolwork and sports because that is a privilege. And I just wanted to give back and help, because I had a lot of help, when I was growing up, in that age group. And, you know, if I did not have that help, I would not have learned if I would have continued with the sport. So I just wanted to get back to my, yeah, to see my community.

Sue Anstiss (20m 1s):
Excellent. What about athletics? I often think it is almost a sport that's more accessible for children from young marginalized communities and so on, perhaps than other sports. Is that something that you've found? Is that something that you feel?

Katarina Johnson-Thompson (20m 13s):
Yeah, I believe so. I think that the, where I can speak for myself, but when I joined the Liverpool Harriers, our local club, it was 100-pounds. I think it was until one plan to use the track. And, you know, it's just the pair for that one pair of running spikes. And you can just do most things, you know. I used to hide, jump long jump, do everything in one pair of running spikes, when I first started. And yeah, it's just get them in and then you go, and even at the track, you could borrow some. So I think it is very open to all sorts of people to come and just try the sport. And it is the basics. It's the foundation of any sports as well. So if you start in athletics, then you know, if it's not for you, then you can go and use the, you know, speed or the strength that you've trained or in athletics and in different sports too.

Sue Anstiss (21m 5s):
Excellent. You say a fantastic foundation. It's obviously been a really important year in terms of Black Lives Matter and the public's changing perception around racial equality. I just wonder if it's made you reflect on your own upbringing in Liverpool and any racism that you experienced at that time and how kind of sport helped you there.

Katarina Johnson-Thompson (21m 23s):
Yeah, it definitely made me reflect on it for sure. I've spoken about it in the past. Then I think that, you know, it's important to reflect and understand, you know, your past and your upbringing and how I, you know, saw myself in regards to, you know, some of the comments that I had or some of the microaggressions that I faced. And I think, yeah, sports definitely helped me have a thing. I think for sure, like athletics was my thing. I was the fastest and yeah, it just helped me concentrate on something that I loved for sure.

Sue Anstiss (21m 58s):
And now fantastic that you were helping others to kind of find that sport and outlet too. We talk of, obviously we know that sport can be so transformational for girls and boys, in terms of confidence and well-being, but especially for girls, I think they face so many body issues growing up and we're kind of seeing more and more of that in terms of social media at the moment, too. How did you deal with that as a young sports woman? Was that ever an issue for you?

Katarina Johnson-Thompson (22m 21s):
Yeah, I think that was a big issue for me. I had a lot of anxiety about, you know, going out there and competing and showing my body, when I was younger and I wasn't as competent. I also had a lot of anxiety about training my body and making it appear more masculine and muscular. When I was sort of going through puberty, I was the age of like size zero and that, so I think, you know, the world has changed a lot, in the last 10 years. And it scares me that bodies can be trends, but I'm happy that it's going in the right way, where a lot more people are accepting that everybody is different and everyone's got their own body shapes. And we can see that not just in the Olympic sport and athletics and the heptathlon, like the heptathlon is the prime example of you can win in all these different ways and it's not one body shape, you know.

Katarina Johnson-Thompson (23m 11s):
We're all very different in the heptathlon, in terms of our strengths and weaknesses. And then, you know, we've just got to acknowledge our strengths and weaknesses and use them to our advantage. You know, I hated being the tall muscular, you know, teenager growing up, but now it's really paying off for me and my sport.

Sue Anstiss (23m 28s):
Absolutely. I often think it's tough as a female athlete, as a track athlete or track and field, because you're literally so on display in your kit, not skimpy kit, but, you know, in terms of who are your body being up there and on display. So do you think that will change in the future or do you think that will always be the case and we'll just accept bodies as they are more moving forward?

Katarina Johnson-Thompson (23m 48s):
No, I think the world's changing in a very rapid pace. And I think the younger generation is growing up in a world where we're talking about a lot more stuff openly and with being body positive and body shaming is less of a thing. So I think that that's hopefully going to change.

Sue Anstiss (24m 5s):
Really positive. Yeah. Hopefully we are seeing changes there. So I guess looking into the future now, as we discussed, Tokyo is not far away. I just wonder, looking ahead, if you did win the Olympic Gold, do you think you will keep competing after Tokyo? What are your thoughts there?

Katarina Johnson-Thompson (24m 20s):
Yeah, I think so. For sure. You know, I've got a lot more years left in me. I still don't feel like I've reached my full potential and I haven't won, you know, everything there is to win, yet. Like I said before, I still got a lot of unfinished business.

Sue Anstiss (24m 35s):
And in terms of life after competitive sport, clearly you've set up the amazing academy and the kind of work you're doing with campaigns, like Game On. But what would you hope for, have you got thoughts for life after competitive sport in the future?

Katarina Johnson-Thompson (24m 47s):
I think I'm just gonna get like a house with a big backyard and then go load the dogs. I think that's what I'm going to do.

Sue Anstiss (24m 56s):
I love that. What dogs do you have? You've got two dogs, you said?

Katarina Johnson-Thompson (25m 1s):
Two little sausage dogs, but I'm currently obsessed with the Hungarian Vizsla.

Sue Anstiss (25m 6s):
Oh, I love them. I love them.

Katarina Johnson-Thompson (25m 7s):
I've researched a lot and yeah. I just think every search says that they need like two hours walk every day. So I'm not ready. I still live in apartments and then Liverpool [inaudible] 50. So yeah, I think I'll buy a house for a dog.

Sue Anstiss (25m 22s):
That's Definitely on my wishlist too. And just looking back now, if you were giving advice to yourself, so that young, I guess the 19-year-old coming into London, you know, I didn't realize that you were still a student then at that time, too, but looking back, what advice would you give to young female athletes or sports people from any sports coming into sport?

Katarina Johnson-Thompson (25m 44s):
I think the advice that I would give any female athlete or the advice that I give myself is that, you know, everyone's journey is different and don't compare. Comparison is really never a productive thing. So no, just focus on yourself and don't put too much pressure on yourself as well. Just everyone's journey is different.

Sue Anstiss (26m 7s):
Thanks again to Katarina for taking the time out of her hectic schedule to talk to me. I can't wait to see her back in action, in Tokyo, later this month. It was lovely to hear her talk about the impact of Jessica Ennis-Hill and Denise Lewis. And I'm incredibly lucky to have spoken to both of them for The Game Changers. You can hear their fascinating stories and all of my previous guests at And that's also where you can see more of the other work I do, including The Women's Sport Collective and network for all women working in sport. And you can also sign up to Changing The Game, our free weekly newsletter that highlights the latest developments in women's sport.

Barclays (26m 54s):
Thanks again to Barclays for their kind support of The Game Changers.

Sue Anstiss (26m 58s):
To Sam Walker, our executive producer, Rory, our screen on sound production and to Kate Hannon behind the scenes, making sure everything runs smoothly. Do come and say hello on social media where you will find us on Twitter, Facebook and Instagram @TheGameChangers or @SueAnstiss. The Game Changers. Fearless Women in Sport.